An Introduction to Christian Doctrine Part II

0:06 Good evening, everyone. Grace and peace be unto you from God, our Father and Jesus Christ, our resurrected, risen, reigning and returning Redeemer. This is yet another day the Lord has made, and I'm grateful, and I pray you are as well, to join in with us for our Tuesday evening Bible study. And I want to welcome those who may be here with us for the very first time. If this is your first Bible study at AlphaTreat on Tuesday night, you're not ashamed to be recognized. Just wave a hand. We don't know anybody here for the first time. We've got some first-timers. Help me welcome them, y'all. So we thank God for new faces tonight. Bless you.

0:41 Grateful to God that the Lord put a Bible study in your mind and directed your feet here to us. To our family who's watching online, welcome to you as well. We're going to hustle through some things tonight and prayerfully end a little bit early if you pray for me. I've got a flight to catch to be in school early in the morning, so y'all pray for your pastors. It's going to be a long night, long night, long night, long night. I want to apologize. A few weeks ago, we started part one of Christian Doctrine. And when we were mapping out our Tuesdays, I failed to recognize that I was to be in revival last week at Grace Baptist Church in Mount Vernon, New York, where my godfather, Dr. Franklin Richardson, is pastor. The reason I forgot was because he didn't send me a letter inviting me. Have you ever known folk they just take for granted because of who you are. When they call you, you gonna come. He called me three days before and said, you still coming?

1:34 And I had to say yes. So my apologies for missing you all, but I'm grateful to God for the Reverend Emmett Dunn, who was able to fill in and keep you all on track with our study. So we are going to do a quick review and then try to pick up where we left off. So for those who may be joining us for the first time, you're not gonna miss anything because we're gonna do a little recap. And I do wanna remind you always that the PowerPoint slides are available online one day after our Bible study. So if you missed something or we moved too fast, don't feel like you've got to pull your phone out and snap pictures unless you want to. You can actually go online and download the presentations on the next day. So we are in a series on Christian doctrine and we began two weeks ago kind of talking about what doctrine is and the stereotype that comes along with the phrase doctrine.

2:30 I share with you all, I was watching television early one Sunday morning, and a broadcast came on for a ministry slash church, and part of their brand, their tag, their marketing was, we are a doctrine-less church. And although I think they meant well, it's a real danger to declare that we are doctrine-less. that almost suggests we don't believe in anything. But that tag came from the negative stereotype that is usually attached to the term doctrine. That when we hear doctrine, we usually think of brainwashing. We think of being forced to think certain things. So we're trying to reclaim what doctrine really is. We began our discussion with what is doctrine, and you remember it is rooted semantically semantically from the Latin to teach or teacher or teachings, that it is a body or system of teachings related to a particular subject. And typically doctrine is utilized in Christian language. You don't hear the word doctrine too much about other things, but it's a statement of the most fundamental beliefs of Christianity regarding the nature of God and God's relationship with humanity. So it's how we package the core things that we believe in, and we use that term doctrine. You'll recall that doctrine is really the study of theology. Theology is the study of God, and therefore doctrine at its base deals with truths about God. And that's where we start to spin off a little bit when we talk about truths about God. Because the question we're going to ask is, what is truth, and how does one know it? You'll recall that I asked you all to look at several passages of Scripture. And for those who are not here, you may want to jot these down or make sure you pull this slide up, but there's certain passages of scripture that we looked at that really talk about how humanity knows God, how we can claim to know anything about God or what God's relationship is with us.

4:38 And as we read through all of those, we kind of summarized afterwards what we heard. and a few things that came out about knowing truth about God. One is a reminder that God is not human, that God is a mystery that can only be known through and by God's own self-revelation. I want to reemphasize that, that God ultimately is not human. I know we speak of God in human language, but I hope all of us understand that when we say God sits on the throne, that is metaphorical language, that God is not some superhuman being sitting on an actual throne up there as if heaven is only above us that's all metaphor that's used to describe something that's much bigger than what we can really know that God is ultimately mystery and the Bible continues to remind us of that as God deals with Job to let him know you don't understand everything about me when God declares that my ways are higher than your ways and as the heavens are above the earth so is God above us that Paul says in 1 Corinthians 4 that we are stewards of the mysteries of God. And therefore, the only way you and I can truly know God is by God's own desire to reveal God's self to us. We may desire to know, but in any way that we know anything about God is because God has chosen to initiate self-revelation. And the Bible repeatedly shares that with us, that God decides to let us have the privilege of knowing who God is by God's own self-revelation.

6:12 Share with you, secondly, that God's fullness outweighs humanity's comprehension. That no matter how astute we are, no matter how theologically grounded, no matter how many scriptures you think you know, here's the reality. You never fully understand everything about God. that God at times, I believe, intentionally operates outside of the box you put God in to remind you you can't put God in a box. Does that make sense? So just when you think you know everything, God flips the script intentionally because faith requires an understanding of that mystery. Faith is not certainty. So I'll give you an example. Do you remember when God is interacting with Satan over the testing of Job? Job chapter 1 and 2.

7:10 Acts is all of Job 1. And Satan makes this statement that's really curious. He says to the Lord, does Job fear you for nothing? The King James says, does Job fear thee for naught? You've got to love King James. And what in essence Satan is saying to God is, listen, the only reason Job worships you is because Job has found out that when Job does A, God does B. So it's a holiness relationship. What Satan is arguing to God is the reason Job is righteous is because he's found out that righteousness always has a reward. The reason Job is holy is because when he's holy, you protect him. When he's righteous, you bless him. When he prays, you answer.

8:02 When he serves, you lift him up. There's a relationship there of almost cause and effect. And what Satan tests God and tempts God is, because God says to him, don't tempt me. What Satan really tempts God to do is say this, listen, that's not real faith. That's a formula. That Job has found a formula that works with you. that if I do this, God has to do that. So what Job says to God is, here's what I double dare you to do, break the formula. Let him be righteous and still wind up sick. Let him do what he thinks will cause you to do something and you don't do what he thinks you ought to do and watch how quickly he'll curse your name. Because what Satan is tempting is saying, listen, that's not real faith. If you can predict and put God in a box and say that if I do this, I can manipulate God to do that, then that's not real faith and that's not real relationship with the Lord. That's a formula and there's no mystery involved. And so what the test with Job really is, is can Job do what he thinks he's supposed to do and God not do what Job thinks God is supposed to do and Job still have faith in God? Can God operate outside your box and you still have faith in God?

9:11 Can God do something that you did not predict, you did not pray for, that your Sunday school teacher would not, told you would not happen, and yet you still believe that God is real, even when God doesn't live up to the formula. And so because of that, one of the things I said to you, is that one of the most dangerous silent and repeated sins of the church is not allowing for there to be any mystery with God. Do you know who frightens me the most in the body of Christ? People who get God all figured out. People who have expert knowledge that can speak without any mystery of God that this is exactly what God will do, what God will not do. Because I think when we get in those positions, God intentionally steps outside of our box to remind us, you can't put me in a box. God is not a subject that can be mastered.

10:07 We can think we know some things about God, we can be assured in a few things, but we never master everything about God. You can't get a PhD in God. God is bigger than our human comprehension. And one of the examples we used was in Job 42. at the end of Job's struggle, we find out that God's real issue was never with Job. God's real issue was with Job's friends, because Job's friends had God in a box. And the box went a little like something like this. Job, you wouldn't struggle unless you sinned, because God would never do that. And so at the end, God comes up and says to Eliphaz, Bildad, and Zophar, you've not spoken to me what was right, that you all put me in this box, that said, I can only do this based upon what you do, and I'm much bigger than that.

11:00 So the entirety of the book of Job, I believe, is meant to remind us that God is bigger than our understanding. So the question that began to point us in some contentious directions, how do we know what we say we know to be true about God, and how certain can we be that we are correct? If God is mystery and God cannot be boxed in, how do we know what we say we know to be true about God, and how certain can we be that we are correct? Now, you can answer this variously, but understand for me, I have difficulty with anyone who says that we can be absolutely certain. That God is much bigger, even by the testimony of Scripture, than what we can know. So how do we know? How do you know God is merciful? How do you know God is love?

11:54 How do you know God will forgive sin? Huh? You can answer. Pop quiz, how do you know God will forgive sin? That's the core of what y'all preach in this Baptist church. Every Sunday, God forgives sin. That's what you come in here to hear. The preacher tells you that all the time, and you believe it. How do we know God forgives sin? In what ways? What did you say, Mel? In Jesus Christ. So Jesus, because of Jesus, you know God forgives sin. Okay? How do you know God forgives sin?

12:26 Because he forgave yours. That's not Jesus. That's experience. How do we know God forgives sin? I thought y'all were Baptists. There it is. Somebody just said it. Who's Baptist in here? Because it's in the Bible. The Bible said it. I was waiting for a good Baptist answer. We'll have to change the name of this church.

12:46 So here are the different answers. Jesus, my personal experience, Scripture, which goes to show that what we say we know about God comes from different sources. Now, in best case scenario, they all line up. The question that's going to mess you up tonight is, what happens when they conflict? What happens when what you read in Bible conflicts what your experience was and what you thought you knew about Jesus? How do you work that out?

13:16 Second question that we've just started getting into is what are the sources? How does God reveal God's self? If all we know about God is by God's, initiating God's own self-revelation, in what ways does that come? We just named three, but I would probably suggest to you that there are many more. That's where we left off last week. Any questions before we start getting into the list? Cassandra. The people online can't hear? Someone text you to let you know? Ain't that technology? Ain't that something? Maybe the Holy Spirit doesn't want you to know.

14:00 Who's up in AV? Is Bobby up there? So we're having some online issues, if you guys can check into that. Thank you, T. So my apologies to the online community. You know, we're going to try to work it out. I need my seat of gospel ministry here. We're going to try to fix that. What are the sources? What are the various ways that any human being can say that they've discerned or discovered or learned something about God? Right? So in a moment, after we think we've completed the list, I'm going to ask you, you're going to have a challenge of something you need to do, and it's going to be a little disturbing. So let's prayerfully get there.

14:47 So sources of divine revelation. I think we got through about two of them last time. Let's review those two. What's one of the very first ways we know anything about God? Jesus Christ, right? I had you all read Hebrews chapter 1, beautiful in the King James Version. God in century times has revealed himself to the prophets, but in these former days has revealed himself to Jesus Christ, the express image of God. It's a beautiful passage that basically suggests that God's final and God's full revelation of God's self is most clearly seen in Jesus Christ, right? that the gospel writer John grabs a hold of this when he says in the prologue of the gospel of John that in the beginning was the word, the word was with God, the word was God, and then drop down to verse 14, and the word was made flesh and dwelt among us and we beheld his glory as of the only begotten of the Father.

15:43 That when we say Jesus Christ is the Son of God, that's a little misleading because we don't view it really technically as Father, Son. We view it as God coming down God's self and saying, here I am. Here's a real glimpse of me. The prophets messed it up. The law wasn't clear. So God decided in the fullness of time to say, let me show you who I am, and I'm going to come down in Jesus Christ. That's why we have this incarnation. When you use the word incarnation, you're really describing a doctrine that says that God descended from heaven and God dwelt in earthly flesh that we could see and understand who God is through the living example of Jesus Christ. right incarnation is a doctrine of christianity that our god does not just reign in heaven our god in the fullness of time came down and made himself manifest in jesus christ if you're old school baptist you know how to say he came down through 40 and two generations that's that that's old school anybody ever heard that term it's not 42 it's 40 and two generations um that we know him in Jesus Christ.

16:48 And I suggested to you that although Scripture is second, for me, Jesus is first. Right? That there are a lot of people who put Bible as the first way of knowing God, and if you do, if when you rank these, Bible is one for you, then you are technically evangelical. Right? That for you, everything boils down to the Word, whereas for me, the Word has to be interpreted through the life of Jesus Christ. that I'm not trying to model my life simply after Scripture. I'm trying to model my life after Jesus Christ. So for me, understanding the life, the ministry, the message of Jesus Christ is critical for understanding the Bible because I would argue that if you don't get Jesus right, you're always going to get Leviticus wrong. If you don't get Jesus right, you're going to mess up Revelation. If you don't understand the ministry and the life of Jesus Christ, then you're always going to get the prophets wrong.

17:44 That we, for me, Howard John starts my Bible reading not in Genesis but in Matthew. That until we get gospel right, you're going to get the rest of the Bible wrong. And I believe history is littered with people who use Bible incorrectly because they never had Jesus right. The Bible is dangerous in the hands of one who doesn't have Christ right in their heart. So for me, it starts with Jesus. But then, of course, we embrace the word. Now, I got in trouble because someone thought I was saying we need to throw the Bible out. I'm not saying we throw the Bible out. I'm saying we read the Bible through the life of Jesus Christ. Because the Bible, for those who put Bible 1, 2 Timothy 3, 16, 17 is critical for you. All scripture is given by inspiration of God. Evangelicals live on that verse. The Bible was given by God. Here's the evangelical perspective of Bible.

18:38 God blew the Bible out. and so for evangelicals and there's nothing wrong you hold the bible as if it was god's precious gift that god breathed out of god's own mouth and what you have is equal to jesus christ in the word of god the term that is important for that is theo neustos say it with me theo neustos you should hear the words theo for god neusto from pneuma from pneumonia it means breath It means that God breathed. Evangelicals believe that the Bible is literally birthed by God. Now, where Howard John Wesley has trouble with that is not accepting that human hands are part of the creation of Bible, that the Bible didn't just drop out of heaven from God's womb. God used human beings.

19:32 And whenever you add humanity to what God is doing, there's always an element of being flawed. Because no human is perfect other than Christ. We'll talk a little bit more about this in our doctrine of the Bible in a little bit. So yeah, Jesus Christ, we have the Holy Word of God. Let's look at a third source. Third source is human reasoning, and I'm going to qualify it by saying assisted by Scripture and the Spirit. Now, why would I say human reasoning that is assisted by Scripture and the Holy Spirit? because it's possible for your thinking to be wrong. right it's possible for your thinking about the Lord to be wrong so one of the ways that we kind of judge whether my thought of the Lord is right or wrong is is it guided by what I read in scripture and is it guided by the Holy Spirit so clearly human reasoning cannot sit at the top of the food chain. Because for us, for Howard John, it needs to be shaped by something. Have you ever been in a religious setting where someone has some wild thought about God and you want to know where they got that from? And you want to ask, does that line up with scripture? By definition, that means that you put scripture above human reasoning because you're going to subject human reasoning to what you understand in scripture.

21:09 And if your thoughts are deep and wild about God, but they're not lined up with scripture, it's a problem, right? Because we put scripture above human reasoning. But human reasoning is a tool that God uses. It is how God reveals ourself, God's self. Look at 2 Timothy chapter one. Well, no, you go to John 14. I'll tell you what 2 Timothy one is. God's not giving us a spirit of fear, but of love, power, and what? Do it again. God's not giving us a spirit of fear, but of love, power, and a? somebody say sound mind. The one of the gifts of the Lord is a sound mind that God expects us to use. Having faith is not an excuse for acting a fool.

21:49 For doing unwise things. So you cannot tell me that God told you to take a step off the 26th floor of your building and the Lord's going to sustain you. That's not sound. That's not a sound mind. God expects us to use it that for me one of the ways I know I'm in the will of God is I sit and I rationalize things and I believe that God uses my mind as much as my spirit so I'm going to weigh things out I'm going to check resources I'm going to list out the pros and the cons I'm going to pray about it then I'm going to think about it then I'm going to pray about it then I'm going to think about it and if I don't think right about it I ain't doing it because I trust God using my sound mind John chapter 14. Verse 25.

23:04 mind the things that the Lord has spoken. So the Holy Spirit engages us through sound thinking as well. That's not just emotional. It's not just I felt it. It's not just I want to shout about it. Does it make sense? And sometimes I think that's a question we need to ask before we run out following the Holy Spirit. Does that make sense? Right? But you run after someone just because you got a warm, fuzzy feeling. You feel the Holy Spirit said that's what be your man. You better check that joke out.

23:35 But think about it. I need to know your credit score before we start going down this road, you know. Sound mind. Someone say sound mind. Another source of revelation from the Lord that I know is a little bit difficult in Protestant traditions, but not on the Catholic side, are the teachings of the church from Jesus through the apostles and succeeding generations.

24:07 Now, this would probably go across a lot better in a Catholic tradition, but there's something to be said about knowledge that's been passed on from generation to generation to generation. in Matthew chapter 16 Jesus speaks to Peter he says thou art the rock and upon this rock I will build my church the gates of hell shall not prevail against it then he says something that's strange if you're looking at Matthew 16 he says and I give you the keys to the kingdom whatever you bind on earth will be bound in heaven not the other way around read it correctly not what is bound on heaven will be bound on earth. He gives Peter the keys to the kingdom and says what you bind on earth, I will bind in heaven.

25:01 For those that have any Catholic background, you know that that verse right there establishes two doctrines. Let's talk for a minute. That one verse right there in Matthew 16 is critical in the Catholic side. And let's acknowledge this. that 98% of Christianity has its rooting in the Catholic Church, including you Baptists, right? That that's how Christianity began in this one movement. Catholic means universal, right?

25:57 So a lot of our teachings, what we believe, were birthed out of what the Catholic Church had passed down, and even though we revolted against some of it in Protestant, which you already hear the word protest, because that's what it was, The Protestant Reformation was a protest against some of the teachings of the Catholic Church. Most of what we still believe has been passed down to us from the original apostles, passed down to generations of generations of generations. Let's talk about this in Matthew 16. Everyone say Petrine succession. All right, come to the Bible study, learn. Petrine succession, you ought to hear the word Peter in there, right? Petrine, Peter. Petrine succession is a doctrine that basically teaches this. You're Peter. I'm Jesus. I'm giving you the keys to the kingdom. You now have the authority to bind on earth what I will bind in heaven. What you say is righteous on earth, I will honor when they stand before me in heaven.

27:00 Now, what kind of authority does that sound like to give one man that much authority to say, this is what ought to be on earth because this is what God says in heaven. Who has that kind of authority? The Pope. Papal infallibility means the Pope can never be wrong. Because when God, when Jesus gives Peter, the first Pope, the authority to bind on earth, he's saying to him, you can never be wrong. Whatever you bind on earth, I will bind in heaven. It's where the doctrine of papal infallibility comes. Papal infallibility, the Pope never fails. The Pope is never wrong. Now, here's the way it works. So when Peter's getting ready to die, Peter has got to pass off those keys. So Peter passes it off to the next pope. It can't be you. You're a woman.

27:51 I'm sorry. I'm not just Catholic. Just be a Catholic. You know I'm joking, right? Okay, okay, okay, okay. So it goes to the next, and it keeps getting passed on. So when a pope dies or steps down, they gather together. You know they're in that room and you wait for the white smoke to come up. That's for them trying to figure out who the Lord says the keys have gone down to. So they literally believe that in the Catholic Church, whoever is pope is a direct descendant of Peter.

28:21 The sitting pope is a direct spiritual descendant of Peter. And he has the same authority that Jesus gave Peter in Matthew 16. Stuff has been passed down. Now, we may not hold to papal infallibility, but a lot of Christians in the world do, Catholics do. So, give an example. Ooh, this is important. There's nothing in the Bible that speaks about birth control. Not one verse. Not one verse speaks about birth control. Why do Catholics believe birth control is not holy? the Pope said so. Ain't got nothing to do with the Bible. There's no Bible. That's what the Pope said. The Holy Church has declared that birth control is a sin to the Lord, and therefore, even though most Catholics probably reject it, they understand that that is the teaching of the church, and that therefore is a sin, not because the Bible revealed it, but because the church declared it.

29:24 there are some things passed on that may not have as much biblical grounding as you think now in our world, in the Protestant world, especially the Baptist world we're going to reject anything that we don't find scripture back and forth, I don't care who said it Pastor, Reverend, Dr. Bishop, whatever if that ain't in the word of God, I don't receive it well no, that's not true we're going to come to one in a minute because I'm going to tell you that that may not be as hard and fast as you think. The Bible has to back up what the traditions of the church are. But there are teachings of the church that have been passed. I'm going to give you an example. Doctrine of the Trinity is a hard biblical argument to make. God is three in one, right? And that's at the core of what we believe. That's how we make sense of God, Jesus, and the Holy Spirit.

30:19 But it's not as biblical as you think. It was worked out by the Holy Catholic Church in 325 A.D. under Constantine, and it's been passed on ever since. If you ever want a historical read, it's kind of dense and a little bit boring. It's called A Brief History of Christian Doctrine. It shares with you some of the debates in the early centuries of Christianity and how the original apostles and fathers of the church wrestled with these ideas and developed an understanding of theology and doctrine that was passed down from generation to generation. So I would argue with you in Alfred Street, maybe 60% of what we believe is still rooted in what was founded by Catholic church fathers and just passed down because we identify that as Christian thought. All right?

31:13 So one of the things I say with this one, especially with young preachers, who now the Lord has given me an opportunity to be in relationship with, see if this makes sense to you. If you have a new theology of God or about God that no other Christian has had in 2,000 years of Christianity, you're probably wrong. if you're sitting in sermon prep and you think the holy spirit revealed to you something no one else has ever dealt with for 2 000 years of christianity you are probably wrong okay if you believe that your thought is novel and earth shattering and i'm gonna teach you some new stuff and i think that's what is difficult for me to digest when i watch so many preachers on tv there's this addiction to being new, to having novel thoughts, to developing new doctrine, to sharing things that are just so...

32:12 So I'm listening to, I'm going to name him George Bloomer, on TV. And his argument is something about Genesis 1, about, hold on, because I was arguing with him on TV. I was just getting mad, I was just getting mad. What was he saying? There's something about the creation and... All right, I don't want to misquote him, so let me not do that, because I'm going in on him, and I don't want to do that without being right. He was saying something about it was a recreating. Like, anyway, stuff that's passed on. So there's some things we know and believe about God because they've been passed on through traditions.

33:13 Share with you another one. Holy Spirit, Revelation. probably all of us have known someone and have probably had a moment ourselves where we believe the Holy Spirit spoke to us. And the Holy Spirit revealed something. Acts chapter 16.

33:37 Really one of my favorite passages of Scripture. Let's look at it. Let's look at it together. Acts chapter 16. It's about Paul's journeys. Acts chapter 16 beginning in verse number 6. Do we know if we ever got the sound worked out? It is? Thank you. Acts chapter 16, beginning in verse number 6.

34:14 This is talking about Paul, Silas, and I think Timothy's with him by this point. So Paul is broken up with Barnabas. Barnabas took John Mark. Silas hooked up with Paul, and now Timothy's with them. So the three of them are on a journey.

35:11 Notice how often the three of them wanted to go in one direction. And the Bible says, but the spirit prevented them. that they're praying about going over there and they felt the Holy Spirit say, don't go over there. So they went somewhere else. how do you know when the Holy Spirit has spoken to you?

35:39 Just want you to think about that for a minute. How do we think Paul, Silas, and Timothy said, the Holy Spirit doesn't want us to go that way? How does one hear the Holy Spirit? and even deeper, how do you know it's the Holy Spirit and something you can and someone you can trust a voice you can trust and discern what for you are the signs that it's God?

36:18 Because in some way, you've got to be able to gauge whether this voice you hear or feeling you sense is the Lord calling you to do something. Something has to be able to confirm it. Now that I've asked that, what helps you confirm that it's the Holy Spirit telling you to do something? Anybody. What helps you know? Because let me tell you, you know why? Because have you ever heard someone say to you the Holy Spirit told them something? You were like, mm. No, the Holy Spirit told you that? I don't question folks' Holy Spirit discernment, but I've heard some crazy things that were blamed on the Holy Spirit, and it made me wonder. How do you know? What makes you, so if you feel, you hear something, you say it's Holy Spirit, how do you test it?

37:15 If it lines up with the character of God. Okay, so... Yeah. So would you say then that you are going to use your sound mind as a way of you're going to use human reasoning to kind of validate whether this is of the Lord or not? What you know in your mind. So you can you may feel somebody like that is not God. That's crazy. Right. Right. So now you've put reasoning above Holy Spirit revelation. No, no. Yeah, you have. I mean, I'm pushing you in a corner because I'm suggesting what I want to ultimately suggest is the Holy Spirit revelation is probably not at the top of many people's list unless you're Pentecostal. Right. If Bible's at the top, you're evangelical. If Holy Spirit revelation is at the top, you're Pentecostal.

38:12 If that's your main way of knowing the will of God is what you feel the Holy Spirit. If you tarry, you are Pentecostal. Anybody know what tarry is? Y'all got some Pentecostal. You know who Terry is? Oh, good. Let me tell you who Terry is. I'm going to make fun of it. Terry is the Pentecostal term for we're going to stay here until we hear from the Holy Spirit. Yes. Yes. We're going to stay in this worship setting, need be all night, until we discern what the Holy Spirit has said. That's why you're Baptist. You're like, uh-uh, uh-uh, uh-uh. Okay. How do you know? you felt you hear, how do you discern is that of God or not? My brother, for you, how do you gauge it? He's brought up, oh, we're going to get a good answer. He's brought up Pentecostal. For me, sometimes I recognize it because it's something that I have heard or saw before.

39:10 So something you've seen or heard before. So now this is more like a confirmation of something that's gone before you. Okay. And it registers then. How do you, how do you filter out? Well, I guess, well, similar to what he was saying, because I think that's the Holy Spirit that brought me here to Alexandria. How'd you know the Holy Spirit brought you here to Alexandria? Let's talk. It does. I heard. You heard. I heard. voice that said Alexandria because I was in Georgia and I was I was not happy where I was and I've been there for 15 years and I was at work one day I heard the voice say get a job Alexandria. At the job, I clicked on, looked for a job. As soon as Alexandria City Public Schools came up, got the job in two weeks.

39:56 Okay. Okay, now, so let me ask you a question, though. Because now we're getting into some confirmations, right, of things opening and laying himself out. What happens if there is no job? Well, I wasn't going to leave the other job. You want to leave, right? So, okay. And deciding the question of faith, I'm just asking, would that cause you to question whether I'm supposed to go to Alexandria or not if there were no open doors? It would have questioned if that was the right time. It's the right time. The right time. So now you realize the equation is getting a little bit more complicated because now we're looking for external confirmations, and now there's a time factor. So you could probably suggest that it's possible to hear, but it not be the right time. So does the Holy Spirit also have to give you a time stamp? The doors have to open.

40:53 So, so just understand what I'm trying to push you at is that it wasn't just hearing a voice that made you go. The door is opening. So now we're looking at external confirmations, right? So it wasn't just I heard a voice and I started running. Right. Well, no you didn't. No, you just said that the doors hadn't opened, you would have said it was the wrong time. No, I'm saying, well, when I heard the voice, I started to apply. Okay. When you heard the voice, you started to apply. All right. I'm not arguing with you. I'm just, no, I'm not. I'm suggesting that it's more than just sitting at home and hearing a voice and I say, I'm going to go. That you acknowledge that you then said to God in your own words, Lord, if this is what you want me to do, you need to give me some external confirmation.

41:52 All right. Okay. All right. Hand it back. How do you know Holy Spirit's spoken to you? Well, for me, it's based on my personal experience and my relationship with the Lord. It's your own personal experience and relationship with the Lord. Okay. Yeah. Okay. Because initially I've had instructions that I disobeyed. Okay. You've had instructions you disobeyed. And I knew that I disobeyed them. And then based on kind of like what she's saying. How'd you know you disobeyed them?

42:18 Consequence. Consequences. External confirmations. Even if those confirmations are closed doors. Okay. But I think what she's saying is not that it's just the confirmation is not what proved it for her. It was proven to her already. What she was saying is that I wouldn't have moved. I wouldn't have been obedient had those doors not been opened. It doesn't mean that the voice itself wasn't sufficient. No, no. So listen, I agree with you. You're making delineation between proof and obedience and faith. I'm asking how you discern that it is so I would argue with you what does it mean to be proven that just that she heard a voice because in her own words I'm not going to put it the only way she knew that that was the Lord really saying it was because she said to God if this is what you want me to do you have to open doors for me no what she said to the Lord and this is my interpretation was that prove it to me by making these doors open and then I would be more obedient But if those doors don't open It doesn't say that God didn't speak to me It just says that I'm going to be less obedient Or I'm going to wait for a time confirmation Or something else Alright I hear it differently because it still needed What I'm hearing from her is that How I knew it was the Lord Was because doors were open That's how I hear it My brother Okay.

43:43 Okay. So, you're engaging sound mind. No. Well, I mean, when I hear the words, I don't debate. Okay. So, you're engaging sound mind. No. Well, I mean, when I hear debate, I hear a battle going on in my mind, right? Convincing self. That's not I at that time. That's me and my desires and my wants. It's kind of like old cartoon. It's just that one and it's just that one. How do you know, though? What makes you decide you're not going to debate? How do you know there's no...

44:35 So you hear the voice. What makes you say you're not going to debate it? Sound mine. Sound mine. Okay. Let me see what we got. No, no. No one is wrong in your answer. I'm trying to figure out for... because I want to lead you to an exercise in the moment. And forgive me, I see tons of hands. I want to get them all. But I need to leave you tonight with a question that's about ranking these. And what I want to make certain you're clear on is, is it really Holy Spirit inspiration or are there other factors involved? Now, for you, there may not have to be. For my brother in the back, there may not have to be. So I'm going to put you way up on the Pentecostal list. I in my personal walk Howard John Wesley not pastor not reverend not doctor have never moved simply because I felt the Lord say something I heard something right for me there's always there always has to be external confirmation and the two for me are joy and peace for Howard John, that if there's no peace in my spirit about it, I know God's not calling me to that. If I'm wrestling, if I'm, so you call it debating. I call it wrestling in my spirit. I think we're on the same page. If I'm wrestling in my spirit over something, I don't believe, maybe it's not the right time, but I'm not going to move on it, right? I'm not, I'm not going to move on it. And the other one is joy. Now I'm not, I'm not saying happiness, but joy, because for me, joy, according to Nehemiah 2, joy and strength go together and I need strength to obey God.

46:22 So if I don't have any joy, then I don't have the strength to do it. And I'm not going to follow that path. A lot of people always ask me, how do they know the will of God? And one of my answers for me personally that I share with them, do you have joy and peace about it? Not that there wouldn't be struggle, but do you have peace in the midst of the struggle? So to give an example, marriage is always hard, but you can have peace in the middle of the struggle. If that's where the Lord has called you to be, it doesn't mean you always can get along, but there's a joy in it that gives you the strength to work through it. So it's joy and peace. So just, again, the question that I just want you to wrestle with is, is it just that you hear a voice and go or have an inkling and go, or do you subject that to other things? Do you subject it to external confirmations? Do you subject it to a sense of peace in your spirit? Do you subject it to wise counsel?

47:15 That's one of the things I didn't put on here and I forgot this should be because I believe sometimes God speaks to us through wise counsel, right? That God places people around us to whom we can go and ask, what do you think about this? To a certain degree, Bible studies about wise counsel. I mean, if you trust and believe, like so if I'm horrible and you don't trust and believe that I can give you wise counsel you shouldn't even be here on a Tuesday right you shouldn't subject yourself to me as a pastor you know I all of us ought to have people up the road who we can go to to speak to about our walk with the Lord and trust their wisdom and counsel to help us discern that doesn't mean I'm just going to jump because she said jump or do it because he said do it but it's part of my factoring in my discerning of the will of God. It's wise counsel. Let me put a few more up there and then I want to hear from you.

48:08 Please know I forgot wise counsel and the Holy Spirit just spoke it to me as we were... I just had Holy Spirit revelation as we were talking. Huh? What's my confirmation? See, that's what I like. Y'all are getting my spirit. But it sounded good. My rational thinking, my sound mind, and my personal experience. So I can put wisdom, wise counsel up there, because I know that I've had experience where wise counsel was critical. So when I felt the Lord calling me to Alfred Street, the beginning was back in 2006, I spoke to my mentors in ministry about it. I didn't even put in an application until I spoke to John Borders. I want to know what he thought.

49:02 I felt the Lord calling, but my experience said I need wise counsel. Personal experience, real important. I'll suggest to you that this is probably one of the most neglected sources, but it's high up there, at least for me, that God has shown God's self in ways that I can't deny.

49:26 And see, here's where it gets dangerous, because you don't have to agree. But I know. I know what God's done for me, whether you agree with it, whether you back it or not. There's some things I just know God has done for me. And God's revealed God's self that way. And I don't need no amen. I don't need a clap. I don't need you to second it. I don't need you to give me no scripture for it. I know. I know what the Lord did for me. And that's the experience in John 9. this boy who's born blind and Jesus gives him sight and repeatedly the Pharisees start engaging the young man and debating him well how do you know he's a savior how do you know who he is and eventually the boy says to him listen I don't know all that this is what I do know right I was blind and now I see now you want to go deeper than that that's between you and the Lord, but this is what I know, right? I was blind. I met Jesus. Now I see. End of argument for me.

50:30 That's all I need, right? And I would hope that you have some experiences like that in your life. Look, I can't explain it. I ain't got scripture to back it up. I don't have no deep theology. This is all I know. I was like this, and now I'm like this, and all it could be was God. and this ranks really high for me at this stage of my life. It may not have been there when I was 20, but where I am right now, when I look back and I see and I know what God is and what God has done, there's some things you can never convince me of, some things I will never believe. and here's the tough part and you can throw scripture at it all day long but I will subject scripture to my personal experience with God and I would suggest that maybe the way you're using it or interpreting it is incorrect because I know what God has shown me I know you don't reap everything you've sown.

51:47 I just know that. And I ain't going to testify because I ain't in any business, but I know that. I know you don't reap everything you've sown. Ooh, Jesus, thank you, Lord. You probably had one of those moments. Ooh, Lord, thank you. That seed did not flourish. All right. and and what so here's my shoe think about this question for a moment because it's about the order what do you do when someone's what do you do when someone's Holy Spirit revelation when their reasoning their use of the word what do you do when their discerning contradicts your personal experience.

52:46 so give an example real quick you all know i was raised old school baptist i tell you that all the time as old school as old school can be um and we were so old school that women had set roles they could and could not play in church and we were we were serious about that right women did not wear pants. They would not let you in the sanctuary with pants on.

53:15 Women were not deacons. They were deaconess, and that's only if you were married to a deacon. The highest honor was a mother's ward. You had to get 80 to get on that. Women were not called to preach at Lillydale. You could be an evangelist or a missionary, but you could not preach. And if you were to speak, they'd put a special mic right down here for you because you didn't go up there. I was raised that way all my life, 18 years of my life believing, and I had scripture to back it up, had scripture.

53:50 Paul says it's unright for a woman to teach a man that women should not have authority over men. I mean, I was so old school, I remember hearing a pastor, well, not in my life, but just to let you know it's not dead, I heard a pastor in 2016 say he couldn't vote for Hillary because women shouldn't have authority over men.

54:14 And every time I see him, I want to kick him in. You know, you're part of the reason we get this. You understand? So I went to seminary grounded in the belief that women don't preach. Never seen one. And I got scripture to back it up.

54:35 Oh, it changed. Zena Jacques. Zena Jacques was in class with me for all three years. We had every class together. She is the most brilliant and prolific preacher I had ever been exposed to. I heard her preach and know I got saved again. She prayed for me, and I know I felt the Holy Spirit. She was smarter than me in every class we ever had. And sitting next to her side by side, four classes a semester, for six semesters,

55:13 you could not convince me at the end of that journey that that woman was not called. so I go back to Chicago, a maverick now, because I know women can preach, you can't tell me women can't preach, I don't care what scripture you throw, I know Xena, right, and I got to make a decision, either Lord is using her, or she's a blasphemy, right, got to make a decision, either she's dead right, or she's dead wrong, and I made the decision, God's got to be bigger than my Lily Dale experience. So I believe this woman who God used to show me something has led me to believe that God is in her. So now I can never deny God using a woman. Can never do it because of one woman. Experience. Don't care what scripture you give me, experience. Very high for me.

56:08 Let's put a few more up. the Bible's clear that we hear the word of God through prophecy and preaching you can read about the different gifts and how God uses the teaching of God's word the danger with if I draw a line between prophecy and preaching the danger is that make sure I can make this clear I've heard preachers quote unquote prophesy things that had no biblical backing and in that instance the only thing that you can use to validate their prophecy is your measure of their anointing does that make sense so it gets a little dangerous so here you are prophesying these things over people's lives and it's not biblical and I believe in prophecy. I believe in a prophetic gift. But at the end of the day, the only thing that you can really use to validate is your perception of that person's anointing and closeness with the Lord about whether you receive it. And I don't hold a lot of people that high.

57:19 So I'll never forget, we were at Concord Baptist Church in Boston, Massachusetts. I kid you not it was back in 95 96 95 95 and Juanita Bynum came through prophetess Juanita Bynum and she don't need the bible right she gonna prophesy all day long with the lord the lord put on her heart this is what the lord said and you know and and people were going in because she they believed her to be anointed and then she went around started laying hands on folk right I mean, they dropping. Bam! Bam! Bam! She came up to me. I said, don't touch me. I'm serious. Don't touch me. I don't know you like that.

58:07 I didn't have that same perception of her anointing, so I'm not receiving the prophecy. And that to me is kind of like the danger because the prophecy, whether I receive it or not, is really based upon my perception of their anointing. So this, this for me, can never be number one. Right. Prophecy can never be number one. Preaching even can never be number one. I'm not going to base my whole life on what a preacher said in the pulpit. And neither should you. If the preacher is being used by God to speak into your life, hear me, it should not be revelation. It should be confirmation. Does that make sense? It should be confirmation of what the Holy Spirit has already been speaking and what you've been discerning in your prayer and what you've seen in Scripture. something that just aligns, but it should not, don't go run and do something just because a preacher told you and it doesn't confirm anything that you felt in your own walk with the Lord.

59:05 God never wants you dependent upon someone else to know God's will. Say again, the church would be a much better place. God never wants you dependent upon somebody else to know his will for your life. God wants you to be able to come to God directly and know God's will. All right, Let's keep this up. The Bible says nature, believe it or not, confirms the will of God.

59:29 This past Saturday at the Royal Priesthood concert, they sang my song. Woo, they sang my song. The heavens are telling of God and his glory. that's my song there's something about looking at this created world that's why the psalmist says the fool has said in his heart there's no God all you gotta do is wake up and look around this thing is too marvelous for God not to be in it nature we put wise counsel up and we've got wise counsel quickly anything else on that list I'm going to have to go catch a flight in a minute anything else that we missed on the list ways in which God self reveals Think about it, but here's your assignment, and we're going to close.

1:00:27 I want you to consider the sources of God's self-revelation in your life and then rank them. What's at the top of the list? What can never be challenged? What governs all the others? and maybe some of them are equal, right? But I think it's a good act of reflection and self-development to know where you believe you hear God the clearest and which one of these can change all the ones beneath it. what's above Holy Spirit revelation what's above sound reasoning what's above Bible if there is rank them even if you got to put two up at number one rank them in terms of which ones have most authority in your life and that's where we're going to begin our discussion next week alright any questions on the assignment everybody clear great let's wrap up everyone to get ready to go on home.

1:01:41 Thank you all. Thank you. Yep, it was a reminder. Next Tuesday is praying with the pastor. So we're going to pick up on the 29th. Okay? Yeah, the 29th will do it. Next week is praying with the pastor. As always, we like to close with lifting the names of anyone who's facing medical procedures or has hospitalizations. If you know anyone that's got a new diagnosis or a new treatment or just needs Jehovah Rapha to be present, won't you name them, please?

1:02:41 Let's pray. Lord, tonight I thank you for granting us the privilege of your presence. And one of the ways I know you're here, Lord, is the hand I hold.

1:03:02 I am holding the hand of answered prayer. I'm holding the hand of someone who's seen you work in their lives. Someone who knows you are real. Lord, I thank you for the various ways that you speak to us. Remind us that the way you speak to me doesn't have to be the way you speak to my sister.

1:03:24 Ultimately, we're all held accountable for what we know you spoke to our hearts. So I pray that you would give us a spirit to be obedient to what you speak in the time in which you call us to do it. Thank you for your word. Thank you for Jesus Christ. Thank you for your Holy Spirit. Thank you, Lord, for the gift of church. If this were irrelevant, we wouldn't be here on a Tuesday. Thank you, Lord, that we're growing closer to you. And now we lift before you the names of those who need to experience Jehovah Rapha, the God who heals. Lord, I know that you are able. I've seen you do it.

1:04:08 We pray not only for healing, but for sufficient grace. We pray, Lord, that you'll be present in every valley of the shadow of death. Be with us now as we leave this place. may we have a good night of rest. Lord, we promise this won't be the last time you hear our voice tonight. May we awaken with joy and may somebody on Wednesday know we were in church on Tuesday. In Jesus' name we do pray.