What Men Want, December CAYA, Hosted by Rev. Dr. Howard-John Wesley

0:08 Grace and peace be unto you from God our Father and Jesus Christ, our resurrected, risen, reigning, returning Redeemer, whose birth we celebrate in the season of Advent. So allow me to greet each and every one of you with the salutation of the season. Merry Christmas to each and every one of you. I pray that you're gearing up with the joy and excitement of what Christ brings to our lives. I'm excited about tonight and clearly so are you. Amen. Whenever we say we're going to deal with relationships, it is standing room only. So welcome to each and every one of you. As we gathered in and I saw people coming, I said, are any brothers coming tonight? Lord Jesus, help us. Do me a favor, reach out to the people next to you. Make sure you know a name. Greet someone with the joy and the love of Jesus Christ. Make certain that you're not worshiping with a stranger on tonight. Thank you. As we welcome reach each and every one of you, we definitely want to send a very special welcome to anybody who's joining us for Kaya for the very first time.

1:37 If this is your first, first Wednesday, being in this space with us as we come as we are and seek to be transformed in the lives that God has called us to live, if this is your first Kaya, would you just wave a hand? We want to welcome anybody for the first time. Whoa! Now do me a favor, if a hand was waved next to you up in the air, lean over and ask them, who you come to see tonight? Who you come? Y'all ain't right.

2:13 You got your Bibles? If you have your Bible or your device, I want you to hear a reading from the Word of God that I think sets the tone for our occasion tonight. I'm excited to get us through our announcements to get into our conversation that I believe is going to be insightful and inspirational. And we have some very special guests who I'm going to introduce in just a moment when we get ready to take the stage. If you would turn with me in your Bible on your device to Genesis chapter 29. Genesis 29. Amen. You shouldn't have any trouble finding Genesis.

2:50 If your neighbor's lost, say Sunday school, Sunday school. Genesis 29. And as you're turning to verse 15, a little while ago we had an occasion of gathering for kaya we called it ladies night and the sisters came and we had a panel discussion about understanding the heart and mind of women when it comes to relationships clearly there are no stereotypes that fit all people but we were blessed in that and one of the biblical models that i always hear willie when we talk about relationships and sisters and being single every sister's waiting on their boaz i'm waiting on Boaz. The Lord is going to bring my Boaz. Well, we're going to flip the script. There's another model I want to lift up for the brother's sake, not about Boaz, but about Rachel. Come on, let's read the word of God. Beginning in Genesis chapter 29, verse 15. I'm reading from the New King James Version. Then Laban said to Jacob, because you are my relative, should you therefore serve me for nothing? Tell me what should your wages be? Now Laban had two daughters. The name of the elder was Leah and the name of the younger was Rachel. Leah's eyes were delicate, but Rachel was beautiful of form and appearance. Somebody say, praise the Lord. Now Jacob loved Rachel.

4:08 So he said, I will serve you seven years for Rachel, your younger daughter. And Laban said, it is better that I give her to you than that I should give her to another man. Stay with me. So Jacob served seven years for Rachel and they seemed only a few days to him because of the love he had for her. Somebody holler Rachel, Rachel, Rachel.

4:35 Any woman you wait, wait and work for seven years and it feel like a day. We got to know what kind of sister that is. We want to know. So as ladies are waiting on Boaz, tonight we got some brothers to help us understand what our Rachel looks like. Come about with me in prayer. I'm excited to get started. Lord, we thank you for the gift of your grace that has surprised us today. Each and every one of us is a recipient of blessings that we've taken for granted. So we pause in this moment right now, God, and honor you for the life you've called us to live, the blessings you've bestowed upon us. and most importantly, our salvation in Jesus' name.

5:20 Lord, we're not everything we used to be, but day by day, we're trying to be more of what you desire us to be. That's why we gathered on a Wednesday night, oh Lord, that in a spirit of laughter and enjoyment, we might also hear your Holy Spirit speak to our hearts and minds. We thank you for our guests who you brought to the space on tonight. We thank you for each and every brother or sister on my pew. Now, Holy Spirit, have your way that we may leave this place refreshed and excited about what it means to serve Jesus Christ. In his precious name, we do pray. Amen. So you all know that there are tremendous differences between men and women. And we were blessed to have a gathering of sisters to give us some insight into the heart and the mind of women when it comes to relationship, because I am still a firm believer that only two men fully understand women, Jesus and Tyler Perry.

6:25 And so the brothers were blessed to get some insight. Tonight we went to flip it around and help the sisters get some insight into the heart and the mind of men when it comes to relationship. Now, let me make a few qualifying comments so that you don't have to send the email, you don't have to hashtag us. Number one, we know that there's no one stereotype of any man or woman and that everyone is different. So what we seek to do is to speak in generalizations in ways that are insightful. Number two, although our conversation is dominant around heterosexual relationships, I want to honor the fact that love exists between those of the same gender and we are not here to deny or disrespect that reality. That's not what we're here to debate about.

7:17 and so I want to honor the reality of love between same-gender individuals. You can disagree with me on that. That's not what this CHI is about. But tonight we are blessed to have three brothers who've come. They're all single, and we're going to find out why in just a minute. Amen. I know some sister came in here like, I need to know what's going on with him. And so... I'm a little thirsty. I'm a little thirsty. Well, I'm going to get in so much trouble tonight.

7:55 Ladies and gentlemen, brothers and sisters, I want to introduce three phenomenal brothers who are here with us, and we're grateful to have them. None of them are really strangers to us. You know them either from their interaction with us or their presence on social media. They are all Christian men called, proclaiming, pastoring, preaching the Word of God, and seeking to live faithful as a single male. at the same time waiting and praying on whatever that Ruth is going to be in their life. I want to use the very first one. He's a brother that's near and dear to me, Pastor Willie Francois. Pastors outside of Atlantic State, New Jersey. He's been with us before, and in my absence, he's going to guide us in pastoral leadership in Kaya. Would you welcome Brother Willie Francois. Come on up, Willie. Take a seat. We want to welcome Willie today. Had a phenomenal vision this year to take Kaya outside and to go into the park while the season was nice, to sit outside and fellowship and talk about the Word of God. And we found a brother right here from D.C. at Zion Baptist who came and led us for our Kaya experiences outdoors.

8:54 I want to welcome back the Reverend Alfonso Campbell III. Would you welcome Alfonso? Welcome, brother. Glad to have you with us today. And I had the joy just a little while ago to meet a young man who's doing great things down in Huntsville, Alabama. The Lord has called him to pastor. He's been there for the last seven years. What he's doing there is very similar to what we're doing here in Kaya. I tried to find out what is all about him. How does he have 40,000 followers on Instagram? He's got twice as many as me. I feel some kind of way about that. and I know that I've heard repeatedly, ooh, I'm coming because he's going to be on stage. I felt some kind of way about that, Tevin, but I want to welcome a brother who is going to bless us today. Would you welcome Pastor Adrian Davis? He goes by A.D. Welcome to Alva Street tonight, brother. Glad to have you. Welcome, welcome.

9:46 So, brothers, let's get started. Let's get started. I'm going to give you an opportunity for a few moments. The way we're going to do this is to ask some questions I want to ask you that hopefully give some insight into the mind of a brother, and trust me, I'm not going to lead you down any dangerous paths. We are in this thing together as men. Then if we have some time, we're also going to pause for some questions from some of the sisters as long as they are appropriate.

10:11 Everybody say appropriate. Brothers, I'm going to give you just a moment to introduce yourselves. Tell us what's important about you that you want us to know, what God is doing in your life, anything at all before we get started. Willie, you want to go ahead? Again, my name is Willie Francois. I pastor at Mount Zion Baptist Church right outside Atlantic City in New Jersey. I also do a lot of social justice stuff. I love my mom.

10:37 I hope she's watching. Love you, moms. Yeah, so that's me. All right, all right. Alfonso? What's going on, everybody? Reverend Alfonso Campbell III here from Zion Baptist Church up the street, Washington, D.C. I don't know if you got any Zionites in here. Yeah, just born and raised here. and I think Howard University grad, Virginia Union. So, yeah. Pastor Adrian Davis, All Nations Worship Assembly in Huntsville, Alabama.

11:07 Yeah. I'm happy to be here. And Pastor, I don't have 40,000 followers anymore. I deactivated my Instagram page. Oh, my mind. And as of last year, I adopted a daughter. So, yeah. That's good. Tell me about it. He got it. He got it. Tell me about it. He's about to give me some water. I'm thirsty.

11:32 Let's pause right there. Pastor Davis, I'm a true believer that social media has changed the world in some real positive and some negative ways. Yes, sir. In relationships, it can be a real danger. Yes, sir. Probably all of us who've been in relationships have had one or two fights that has something to do with social media. Why deactivate your page? All right. Now, for me, I, you know, if you have God's phone, which is the iPhone. I am. I am. God's phone. Y'all, Troy, you can just get out of here. No green bubbles. But no, like, I was looking at my productivity, and I've been passionate for seven years, and I own a sneaker store as well. I was leaving out of the store one day, and I immediately got on Instagram.

12:28 And even though Instagram is an awesome tool, but also it can become such a draining mechanism. And so I looked on my iPhone and I looked at how long I had been spending time on Instagram. And sometimes that thing could tell on you, you know, like you've been on here eight hours. And I'm wondering why in the world can I get this done or why hasn't this book been released or why hasn't this been done. But in the relationship aspect, it kind of shut down the whole, you know, our generation is a generation that is locked into clout. So they'll say, oh, I like that post. And if you respond back, thank you, then it's, oh, Pastor Ad was in my DMs. Because it's a clout thing. I want to say that I had a conversation with them. So to cut down all of that, to cut down and to focus in my attention, I can reactivate it whenever I want to, but right now it's just important for me to focus. I know that.

13:19 I know that. And not that there's only... I want to answer your question. I want you to answer it from one of three positions and then go whichever direction the Lord leads. The question is, why are you single? And not to suggest that something's wrong with being single, but what we kind of dealt with with the sisters is that it probably falls in one of three categories. Maybe that's something to do with the Creator. Do you believe that God has you in a single season? And if so, why? is it about some consequence some things that may have happened recently and that'll launch a pad into dynamics of relationships or is it by choice you've simply reached a place where for right now in this season of life you've decided to be single now I also want to qualify because I don't know your personal lives when we say single we mean not married you may be actively involved that's for you to tell if you want to but by single we mean not married married. So Alfonso, creator, choice, consequence, or something else? Why are you single, brother?

14:34 I think I would say, man, that's a hard one. Possibly a combination between the two of choice and creator. I think the beauty of singleness is being able to figure out who you are. And so it's kind of given me the opportunity just to be able to sit with me. I think very early on, I would send out a representative and not my true self. And so the greater that I've spent time with, well the more that I've spent time with myself, the more I've come into a true self. And so that's kind of like the choice option of it, where I knew that I needed to take some time to get inside, to be internal and recognize who God was in my life and understand my identity. out of that, I think that's kind of helped me to now be the person I need to be and not feel like I have to send out a representative when I'm dating.

15:33 So before I give the other two, I want to push that a little bit. All right. So with one, how old are you? 31. 31. When did you start sensing that maybe I need to step back, that this is not the authentic me at what age? Probably late 20s. Late 20s? Late 20s. I think that's at a time where it's like, oh, okay, this is the end of a decade. I've had my fun.

15:57 And now... We're not going to talk about what fun looks like. But, you know... We'll come back to that. Right, right, right. What I just backed myself into. But no, I think it was at that point where I realized that I had to start, one, reimagining what my relationship with love looked like. I think there was this idea of just pursuit, pursuit, pursuit, or the idea of men have to get as many women as you, you know, you just go on after women, and that hunter mentality. You realize that you're hunting her rather than actually finding somebody that you can grow with. So I think that that's a point where I, like near those late 20s, I think that's when it began to kind of change for me. Last point with this. We talk about the representative, clearly, and I don't mean this to trivialize or be disrespectful, but a man that's in that mode is typically going to present what he thinks is attractive to a woman.

17:01 Absolutely. So that helps us understand the mindset of what you saw and thought women wanted. If you could list two or three things that always were on that representative list that may have been authentic or inauthentic to your true self, it helps me understand and the ladies see what men think a woman wants and what they put on the resume of the representative. What goes on that resume of the representative? I think you kind of come off like, all right, how do I want clothes? How do you look fly? For me, how deep are your pockets initially? And then just this idea of this sense of being overprotective. You know, I think I had a very property mindset at one point, that she's property. And I always felt like, okay, so she belongs to me.

17:58 And that's something that I knew that I had to change, that I had to switch out of. Because to me that was the idea, like, okay, this is my girl. You know, I'm going to protect her. I'm going to do all this other stuff. But I realized that I had to dig deeper beyond that. A.D., creator, choice, consequence. Why is A.D. single? Choice and consequence. Whether, and the reality of it is, is that I choose to be single, but then also there is an underlining thing of shame. you have lived a colored past, like Pastor Alfonso was saying, like the fun aspect. It's almost like, who wants to deal with this backstory?

18:57 Who wants to hear about the stories of women in the past? Who wants to love me beyond that? And I think a lot of times, I think the church has been guilty of over-emphasizing women's worth but not men and so for me for me it's you know dealing with some shame we were talking upstairs and I told you how you know I take sabbatical every year and then when I went to a counseling facility no TV no cell phone just a male intimacy course about why I feel the way that I feel I think it's so important for us to realize that even through our decisions we may be making making our decisions through a lens of shame or through a lens of God is punishing me or man I messed up again or whatever the case may be.

19:51 So for me I think it's a duality of both. I think it's decision, choice, but then I think there's an underlying thing of shame. Willie? Same question. Creator, consequence, choice. Yeah. I'm probably leaning between living in the tension of consequence and choice. One is I probably have a love. I am trying to outgrow some underlining selfishness that I may live with that is hard to really cultivate enduring, longstanding relationships. It's hard to do that when you're selfish, right? Right? And selfish in the sense that I have deeply prioritized what it means to do what I do as a pastor, as a scholar, as an activist.

20:46 I breathe a lot of life into that and because of that, other things in my life get neglected. And so, and part of my drive, it's not always this like need to achieve, but it's part of of my drive has always been, part of the drive has always been leaning into a representation of myself that I think is attractive, right? So while I'm trying to push forward, like being this successful black man, right, this being, you know, black men can be unicorns too, right? So I'm trying to be this unicorn, right, this professional young black man for the sake of looking attractive, feeling appealing, but at the consequence of that, that becomes the altar that I sacrifice loving, mutual relationships, right? So, it's consequences in that sense, that underlying selfishness. And, you know, I've had to start over relationships a lot of times because of my underlying selfishness. I had the type of fun that you should not be having sometimes, right? And so, yeah, I'm not going to say exactly what it is. I had some fun that I shouldn't have been having that cost me, you know, that breached relationships, breached trust. And so, the starting over factor is a consequence as well. But yeah, it's, but I read both of them as like a type of selfishness that I had to outgrow one and still trying to outgrow this like, no, my brand is more important than building relationship and building life.

22:20 And really getting to the point where we're thinking about that my brand is not what makes me human. What I do professionally is not what makes me human. But being in relationship with somebody with radical mutuality, radical creativity, radical compassion, radical forgiveness makes my humanity higher, right? So trying to... And it's this groping for what does it mean to be the best human being that I can be? And I have put that on the shelf longer than I should have. That's so good. You know, what's interesting for Kaya, when the sisters were here, the answer was predominantly creator, a sense that they were in a season where God had them waiting or doing something in their lives. And it's interesting that for the brothers, there's choice more involved, that this is a decision. So that leads me to this question. I love the model in Genesis of Adam and Eve because to me it almost indicates how God brings us together and one of the things I think is often neglected about the creation narrative is that if you read the second one Eve is brought to Adam as a consequence of Adam not being able to fulfill what God has called him to do and do it well.

23:36 So Adam has to be performing in his God-ordained purpose before Eve can show up, because how can Eve help what Adam don't even know he's supposed to be doing? So I see this awareness of what God's called me to do, purpose, chasing this get it done. One, I want to ask you, how much do you perceive or sense the need for a helpmate in your life? at this season and stage. Because what I really want to get to, for the sister says, when does marriage start to become a deep desire for men? Because clearly it's later than it is for women. And then... Okay, let me stop the stereotypes, okay? It appears to be.

24:24 So the question is, when do you think or sense a deep desire for an Eve, for that helpmate? And then secondly, because I've held this conversation with a lot of sisters, do you believe there's only one Eve? Do you believe in the concept that there's one person God has created for you, or do you buy into the, with a man, it's about being in the right space at the right season, hearing the right word from God and whoever that woman is at that time may be the one. So two, deep desire for Eve, when does it show up? Do you sense it? Is it on your radar? And two, do you believe that if there's only one Eve or is it a matter of being in the right season, the right space and God bring the right woman?

25:06 Go ahead, AD. Well, for me, you know, when we look at Adam and Eve, I look at the fact that God places Adam. He has a relationship with Adam. Adam knows how to hear from God. Adam has an assignment from God. Adam has a job. Adam is working in that. And then God says, it's not good for man to be alone. I think to hear it's not good for man to be alone, there's a prerequisite of responsibility. that a man must have. But what I love is that Adam never asked for Eve. He was so busy working, God said, what I have for you is bigger than what your hands can hold. So whenever that question arises to me, I come to the place of, for one, is this woman an answer to a problem I don't even know I have?

26:04 because women sometimes come as problems, but not as a problem solver. I think it just got real. We gone. Keep talking, brother. Keep talking.

26:24 So, so, so I think, I think the question, the question is, do you know if you are an answer yet? because Eve was an answer. She was pre-wrapped as an answer that he didn't even know. He didn't ask. He didn't pray. He didn't seek. He was working. And God said, yo, I see you working, but what you're doing is bigger than what your hands can hold. So I, but, and then is there one Eve? I would say, no, I would say it's about season and time.

27:06 Because I don't think that God is a God that is like, it's one and, oh, you missed it, but he's not a redeemer to create another opportunity. So I think it's about the season and the space and the time to change. All right. All right. Alfonso Willis. All right. I agree. I think that when we do look at that story, we see Adam already given his purpose, operating out of his purpose. And I think even just talking from my own personal standpoint, the idea of marriage began to get more serious for me the more that I delve into my purpose. And not just accepting the calling of being a minister, but why has God called, Trey's my nickname, why has God called Trey to be a minister? You know, we're all up here. We all operate in ministry, but we all operate in our own authentic selves. God has called us in our own identity.

28:03 And the minute that I began to search after that, I think it became more real for me. And as we think about that story, too, and the word escapes me, but if you look in the Hebrew for help, it doesn't mean help in the sense of inferiority, but it's divine help. That a helpmate is a woman that comes to, not a woman, but help is the idea of somebody who helps you improve upon where you are. It's an expert, that type of help. And so I think for me, as I've got deeper into my purpose, now I'm searching for somebody who can help me transcend myself while I also do the same for them. To transcend, to see the possibilities of my purpose and where God has placed me. And as far as does God call us for one Eve, I don't know if I necessarily, I don't agree with that because I think we see that some people after death can find another lover. And so if that can happen, I believe that God can allow us to meet multiple people along the way.

29:04 But I think we, once again, going back to choice, we make the choice when we feel our spirit and our soul is connected with another soul. And that's when we decide to do that. Before Willie jumps in, for the two of you, can you look in your past and identify what could have possibly been the Eve, but because you weren't in the right place as Adam, it passed by? For sure. For sure. Woo!

29:34 Yeah. No, no, like, remember we all lying. It's lying. I know, right? Yeah. I'm going to plead the fifth. Yeah, for sure. I think. And I think Pastor Willie really depicted this because I think there's times where we as men put an emphasis in certain things.

29:59 And at times that was that was my church or that was my store or whatever the case is. And I was so focused in on that that I could have met someone. You know, I could have been talking to entertaining someone amazing. but because I would not sacrifice that to put emphasis on this I probably missed out on the eve of the season I think for me so my parents have been married over 30 years I don't know if they're watching so forgive me from I remember the exact amount of years my uncle and aunt for over 45 years as well my grandparents We're married for 50 years. So for me, I saw all these scripts about what love should look like. And so I don't know if I have a, there was one particular Eve that I missed out on, but I know that, I know for me that I was following all these different scripts and not necessarily listening for what God had called for my life, the script that God had placed on my life.

30:58 And so I think that that possibly caused me to miss because for me, I'm looking, all right, so they're not like this, they're not like that. They're not measuring up. When the reality is I needed to search for someone in their own individuality, in their own authentic selves, in their own ability to be fully human. And that's what one looks like compared to these scripts that I had lived up to all my life. So I think I would say that was a major piece of me. So Willie, now three have been passed on to you. A deep sense of when or where a desire for Eve comes in. Is there only one? And do you believe you may have missed some along the way because of other things happening in your life? We know you said you're going to plead the fifth, but that's not an acceptable answer, Kaia.

31:43 Yeah, so in terms of the importance of an Eve, I'm better when I'm in a relationship, right? And I think that part of the brilliance of what Eve brings in that story is that Eve in a real sense becomes like an editor for Adam, right? And really what I'm like makes Adam better, makes Adam full, causes Adam to live up to something that he was operating in but not fully able to live up to in that moment. I think that's the brilliance of human connection. I believe that's the brilliance of relationship is that we become mutual editors of each other, right? Which means if I'm a mutual editor, that means you've got to be able to handle me in my rough draft, right? And there have been times that people, there have been times that I couldn't handle the rough draft or she couldn't handle the rough draft, right?

32:47 But learning how to think of this as, you know, that we're co-editors with one another. So it's important. Relationships are important. now. I'm thinking about marriage more now than I have in the... Why? I'm 33 now. Why? Is it age? Is it season? Part of it is the allure of settledness, right? Like, my life goes pretty fast. You know, I could probably count how often I have to actually get to sleep at home. And sometimes it's like, I want to be settled, right? And the allure of settledness is having a wife, right? A part of that. And I remember, like, I do silly things. Like, I walk on the couch still. I jump in the bed. And like two years ago, I was walking on my grandmother's bed, and she was like, dude, you're 30. I thought you would have been settled down by now. Now, she was talking about something different, but I heard something else. Like, what does it mean now to be grounded? How can an editor help to ground me in ways that I'm not currently grounded? So, you know, so I'm thinking about it in the sense of how do I... I'm with you.

34:04 I'm thinking of it like, so how do I now, like, yeah, that sense of stability is important to me. And it's some of it's age, but it's really this, wherever I am right now, I'm placing a premium on what it means to feel grounded, to feel settled. You know, I haven't lived in the same city for more than five years since I was 18. And so this idea of my life is transient, and I'm really maxing out. I'm trying to graduate out of the transient life, and I think journeying with someone, being able to co-create a life with someone, is incentive to settle, is what I think. Not settling, but to settle down, to settle into something that can launch something else. I don't believe in one Eve. You know, Adam didn't have a choice, you know, but we have choices, you know what I'm saying? You know what I'm saying?

34:58 And I think the power of this is that thinking about something like, I'm talking about being in a relationship with a woman edits me. It grounds me. It helps me to see myself in ways that I really want to be. But what that also tells me is that God actually trusts me to make decisions in my life, right? So I don't believe that there's some prescriptive sister that is just out there waiting for me to get myself together. No, I believe that God trusts me along the way to make decisions that God will bless if we stay together and that God will bless mutually if we decide to walk away. But really leaning into the fact that God actually trusts us to work this life, to live this life, to be in the world. And so that's important.

35:52 I think that I… And so thirdly, there, yeah, there could have been some eaves along the way. They definitely could have. But, you know, back to, you know, back to my own unwarranted fun, you know, I kind of derailed some of those opportunities. But it was a matter of me mismanaging the moment, me mismanaging the experience, me mismanaging the relationship. God trusted me, and God probably shouldn't have trusted me, right? You know, God trusted me to do with it what was possible, right? And sometimes that led to, and it did lead to the dissolution of previous relationships. But yeah, yeah, I believe God trusts us. So I want to preface this. We're going to switch out of Adam and Eve and go back to Jacob that we read from earlier.

36:52 And I'm going to ask you a series of questions. and I want you, as much as you feel comfortable, transparent, honest, and not super spiritual. Now we want to talk to the men, not the reverends, not the pastors, the men, all right? So one of the things in the Jacob passage that we read in Genesis 29 is Jacob comes to a situation where there are two women in front of him, Leah and Rachel. And for reasons the Bible doesn't declare, his real love is for Rachel. And if you know the whole story, his uncle sets him up to marry Leah because there's something wrong about Leah.

37:38 And that's shameful. I don't know what it is. The Bible gives some indicator about her eyes or something may have been physically off. But I want to ask you, and not in physical, not in physical because I believe that the most beautiful woman is the one who's secure. So it's not necessarily a beautiful thing. what what is a pet peeve turn off characteristic about a woman that comes to you that will make you immediately go you are not Rachel you are Leah what what can a woman embody or show in character that makes you say you cannot be Rachel I'm not working seven years for you. so pet peeve character pet peeve AD you want to go oh I will so character pet peeve for me is everybody falls in love or like with the idea of an individual but you but I tell you all the time like you like this now but you hate what it takes to become this a pet peeve of mine is when you start to compare yourself through your insecurity to other people that I have conversation with in what I do I'm constantly talking to women the reality is if I choose to date you I chose you if I wanted them I I could have chose them.

39:30 So it doesn't matter. I think the pet peeve for me is just the lens of the insecurity, whether it's time or whether it's through conversation, whatever it is, you have to be secure within yourself. And it's not my job to heal the area you don't want to walk through. I think at times, and I guess this would be part two of the pet peeves, is where we treat relationships like projects, like individuals, like I got to, you're my project, you know, almost to where, you know, you're blessed to have me, but I'm not blessed to have you, type of situation. And so for me, that's an immediate, you know, people, you know, Our culture is all about, you know, if y'all look good together.

40:25 But we don't understand that we've seen relationships where a guy have an amazing girl that's beautiful externally, break up, go and get somebody else, and then the ex-girl talking about something, well, she don't look better than me, but she doesn't have to look better than you than to be better than you. she could be whole she could be processed things the levels of insecurities and things of that nature so um so i think we got to get out of that but yeah i think it's insecurities for me willie what's the character pet peeve yeah so i've been i've been doing this since i was 16 right i've been preaching since i was 16 uh so there's not been any relationship that i have entered into, been in, where I have not been a preacher. And so one of my pet peeves is, and some of this could be my own anemic perceptions, right? But one of my pet peeves is the first thing you think about is becoming a power couple, right? And it causes me to, And it creates insecurity for me because it causes me to be very, my spidey of senses start going off unnecessarily because I'm always wondering, well, do you like Willie or do you like Pastor Willie, right?

41:45 What's drawing you? What's causing you to be here? Because if you like Pastor Willie, I promise Pastor Willie will let you down, right? But if you're into Willie, then that means you're into looking at this canvas that is incomplete and helping to do some work to complete this canvas, to create this work of art, of life together. But one of my pet peeves is really being in a relationship where it feels like I am clout, where it feels like that what I do is greater than who I am. right? And I think that's one of the dangers of what patriarchy does to men already, because we already see ourselves based on how we perform, what we produce, what we give, right? And if I'm going to be in a relationship, I need to be in a relationship where I can be vulnerable, where I can be sad, where I can cry, where my depression, if my depression shows up, I have somebody who can be strong for me, right? Sometimes in a situation where I want to feel protected, right? And in those places where, and if I'm in a relationship where I feel like it's all about the allure, the look, the presentation, the facade that Willie and I present to the world, it puts me in that mode where I'm being judged as a human doing and not a human being, right?

43:03 So, that really gets me, that what I produce, what I build, what I create, becoming the impetus for being in a relationship, it hurts, right? It embellishes my insecurities of always feeling the need to produce, to perform, right? And so, yeah, that gets me. All right. Alfonso? First of all, I agree with both, so you guys take those pet peeves from me.

43:36 It's going to sound simple, but this is reality for me, and this is a real and relevant church. My pet peeve is when you, like you said, when you aren't able to see my title, and because of that, we aren't able to have fun. So I feel as if I am both righteous and I've got a little holy ratchet. So I want us to be able to be excited about what Jesus did over 2,000 years ago, but I also want to feel some conviction in your soul when you hear the 99 and 2000s come over to speak it as well. If you don't do that, man. And I jokingly say that, but in all seriousness, I feel like that's how I'm able to be my, that's how I'm able to fully show up as me.

44:29 And if I can't exist within both of those spaces for you, then I can't be with you. And so oftentimes I've had to reduce myself to be in relationships rather than live fully to who I need to be. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. I've got a few more, and then I want to make sure we make some time for the sisters to ask you some questions. Two more, maybe three. If you don't mind, will you share,

44:59 and keep, you know, obviously we keep names out to remain anonymous. Oftentimes men are perceived as having this hardcore shell that, you know, because we have to be Superman or simply because we're not authentic, we've not tapped into our own authenticity and identity. The dog stereotype, the just want sex. Can you share with me a moment when a woman hurt you deeply?

45:28 and what it is that got beyond the skin, beyond the stereotype, beyond the look, and got to the heart and left you with some pain. And what you did as a result of that pain. I think for me, wow, okay.

45:49 This is, I guess it's vulnerability. Welcome to Kaya. I think for me, I feel like I had a, relationship where the first one where I was, somebody broke up with me. My previous ones, I was the one who did the break it up. And so to feel that for the first time, it felt as if, and while I understand that in hindsight, in a moment it felt like somebody gave up on me. And I am a lover. I'm one who cares about people deeply. And so the idea of someone feeling like that I'm not enough, which is something that I had to work through.

46:30 And that hurt me in that sense of not feeling like I'm enough. And I think the constructive work that I did after that was realize that no matter what relationship I entered into after, I had to always realize that when God created me, God said I was good. That my first love, that God loved me as I am before I did anything. And that alone makes me enough. And so for me, I had to journey from broken pieces to realizing that I was still touched by the master. And that makes my life a masterpiece. And so coming out of that, making me become a better person, I was able to grow from that and realizing that I will no longer be in a place where I don't see myself enough because somebody rejected me. Gotcha, gotcha, gotcha.

47:24 All right. Willie? something that hurt you? Yes, I mean, I've been cheated on by somebody that was really important to me. And it does, you know, it's kind of leaning into, I mean, I'm sure many people have been cheated on. That's the only time I know about, right? But, you know, because there's some skilled cheaters out here.

47:57 You're good, man. I'm telling you, man. You know, but to be in a relationship that I considered as serious as it was, a relationship that, you know, I could have eaved it up with, you know. That's our new term, eaved it up. I could have eased it up with. It was, I mean, it was obviously betrayal, but it was more, it kind of exposed, like, my own arrogance to some extent. Like, there's no way that could happen to me, right? I created this, I guess I bought into, I've become intoxicated on my own stuff because I'm thinking there's no way this could happen to me.

48:51 And the revelation was it was my own lack of engagement, lack of time that felt to her like a lack of commitment, right? Because what makes, I think, Jacob so honorable in that scene is that Jacob worked seven years and then he worked seven more, right? He's so committed to making that relationship work that he finds the strength to do another seven, right? No, go ahead. I'll just finish by a question. And so what hurt was not just the fact of the abandonment, the fact of the betrayal, but what hurt was what it exposed about who I had become and how negligent I had been in something that I said was important to me, something that I said I valued, someone I said I loved, but that love was not coming through because the commitment was being invested somewhere else.

49:51 And so it exposed, what hurt was that it exposed a part of me that I had been blind to. And it's hard to, when you overcome your blind spots, you realize how far away you are from really being who you think you are, right? And so I had to live in that distance between who I thought I was as a partner, as a boyfriend, and who I really was. So let me ask you real quick, I want to push that, partly because I applaud going through any experience of pain, and rather than coming out bitter, you come out self-reflective, right? But on the flip side, Howard John has the, I'm not going to blame myself victim, right? If you cheated on me, you're the guilty party. Oh, no. And there's no excuse for it. Like, just leave me. Leave me before you cheat on me.

50:45 so could you have forgiven that oh you know you're right and I don't I don't I mean I lived at bitter for a while man I lived at bitter man that revelation came it wasn't like I go through her phone and I'm like you know this is my fault no it wasn't It took a time. Wait, you went through her phone? Uh-oh. No, no, no. I'm joking. No, I don't do that. I don't want to know, actually. I don't want to know the password. I don't want to do that. But, yeah, no, it was something at the time that I could not readily forgive. And I wasn't even attempting to forgive it, right? Because the sting was so deep.

51:41 the wound had the that invisible blood right I was deeply wounded man took to my core that forgiveness was not even on my mind I was like no this is done this is over the reason being I've had more conversations with sisters who at least contemplate the forgiveness more than most men would right did we not hear that I don't know I don't see it right what's hurt you AD So, for me, what has hurt me in the past is when vulnerability is taken for granted. As a man, I hate being vulnerable. I hate it. I hate it with a passion. But I know that in order to properly love, it takes vulnerability. But when I'm vulnerable with you and I share intimate information and when you get upset and you see red and because we as men are stronger than women, but a woman's mouth is stronger than any man in this room.

52:54 And, you know, now you. Now, y'all. OK, so y'all don't want to say amen to that. That's all right. That's all right. That's your weapon. Y'all be like, and I'm going to tell you one more thing. And then all his strength is depleted. He just, you'll make a man feel this small. But in moments of vulnerability where I'm telling you my greatest challenge may be I'm afraid I'm going to end up like my father. And then in anger, you say you're going to be just like your daddy. Wow. now I ain't gonna hit you but it will make me want to shake you like the yoo-hoo but no like those type of things has happened in the past which caused a great deal of pain for me because it makes you not want to be vulnerable anymore but then it It hinders your trust in any other relationship because you feel like all it takes is for you to get, for you to be that upset, for you to go against everything that you said you would not do when you were sober.

54:11 All right. All right. So my last one, and I don't know if we've got questions, Brooke, that we're going to set up for and how we're going to do it, but we try to stay on time. I have two sons, and I heard you say you just adopted a daughter. First of all, congratulations. Thank you. What's her name? Brisha Nath. And how old is she? You don't want to know. Okay. She's grown. Okay. I've had her since she was 17. Okay. So I've got two teenage boys now. And one of the things I, I'm not going to say struggle with, but that I realize I have to impart to them are lessons about dealing with women.

54:54 My oldest is going to have problems. Anyone that knows Deuce, he's going to have problems. He's 6'4", right? Looks like his dad. So I've been sitting debating, like, what am I supposed to say to him? Like, you know, what kind of conversations? Clearly, we've had the condom conversation. He hated it, right? But we have to have these. And then I realized that I've got to have a conversation with him that's not about sex. It's about being a better man than I was.

55:29 And imparting to him a lesson that if I look at you and you're my reflection, that if I could go back, I'd want to make certain you don't do this. Don't do what Dad did here. This was a mistake. Yeah, and I'm going to ask you two questions. It's wrapped up in one. I'm going to put you both on the stage, all three of you as parents. I'm going to make you a parent. What are you saying to your son? And the reason I say that is because it helps you reflect over an area of growth you don't want to see your son repeat. And then secondly, what do you say to your daughter? and that is a question about knowing where men can take advantage of a woman that you want to protect her from so what are you saying to your son as a reflection of yourself that you don't want them to repeat and what are you saying to your daughter that's an understanding of other brothers and what they typically might do to take advantage of your daughter that you want her to be aware of like watch out for this with men Thank you.

56:33 All right. Son and daughter. Okay. I think first one, what Willie kind of touched on it is, one is I even think about what men want. One thing I had to untangle and undo and I learned from my life is attaching patriarchy to my wanting. Misogyny to my wanting. And what I mean by that is I think for a lot of times as men we will objectify a woman. rather than seeing her as fully human. And those are things that we are trained to learn over time. But seeing her in her full self is a piece that I think I would teach to my son that, you know, your desires don't have to be rooted in possessing her, but in loving her. As far as my daughter, one thing I think I would tell her is not to sacrifice your wholeness on the altar of his brokenness. And particularly I see that with black women a lot who constantly are trying to save broken men, that for my daughter, I would want her to be able to discern that this ain't right. This isn't what God has called me to do, and I would want to teach her to value herself first so she doesn't end up going into these places where she feels like she has to keep healing broken men. Meanwhile, she's now breaking herself because she's not able to tend to her whole life.

58:14 Thank you. A.D.? From a boy's perspective, raising a boy, I would, for one, tell him, you don't become a man by how many women you sleep with. Something for me, my father was not a part of my life. My stepfather came in much later. But you begin to think that your manhood, if you aren't careful, you allow the people that you're around to tell you what manhood is and they're trying to explore it as well. And just that laying down women does not make you a man. And, you know, the preacher side of me is the whole aspect of when he says, when I was a child, I thought I was a child, I spoke as a child. But when I became a man, I put away.

59:14 So you're not a man by what you acquire. You're a man by what you release. And the misconception for our generation with manhood is I'm a man by what I get. If I get the house, I'm a man. If I get the car, I'm a man. If I get the job, I'm a man. If I get the women, I'm a man. because we're getters. You're not a man by what you acquire. You're a man by what you're able to release. I'm able to release my pain, my agony, my frustration, my stress, my anxiety. And when it comes to my daughter, Brigene, she didn't have a father at all. And she lived with me. and college and everybody's asking me like you know man like you're 36 you're adopting this this young teenage girl one of the things that I tell her often with men for one I create the blueprint of what she desires in her life I treat her like a queen that's my baby girl she knows the standard not material stuff because just because a man can buy you something does not mean he's going to treat you very well um so she gets time with dad if i'm traveling she she's she's she's preparing me i tell her all the time whenever marriage comes my wife has to thank you because she texts me hey you've been gone too long you need to get here we we got to go movie Like after church on Sunday, we have we go to the grocery store. We go we spend time but I think the biggest thing with her is telling her that You don't fall in love with potential without gauging progress

1:01:14 And a lot of times a lot of times like pastor I'm honestly like you fall in love with this potential But you don't gauge progress So you've been in a potential state for five years and they have not made progress to what you see in them. You can see much more in them than they can see in themselves. And never, never be, never be the visionary for the relationship because you're setting yourself up to pastor that house when you say I do. The roles are automatically reversed because you've been pastoring him for as long as y'all been dating. And so I instilled that in her to, yo, that man has to, even though you may fall in love with, I mean, you look at the rough giraffe or you look at the unedited version, they have to be willing to take the steps to who they desire to become. Yeah, yeah. All right. Willie, and you last one, we're going to take some questions. Advice to my son. I think similar to Pastor A, is that we have to do some serious deconstructing of toxic masculinity, right? How these markers, that society has told us makes us men, particularly black men. Like our flesh has been violated by whiteness and white thoughts, right? To the point that we don't even value our bodies, right?

1:02:36 So one thing, I want my son to value his body, right? His body as whole, whatever it looks like, that his body is enough, his body is precious, and his body is sacred, right? And you do certain things with sacredness that you don't do with things that don't matter. So getting my son to see his body as sacred, I think, is important. And that there is something, and that to be a man means I can cry. To be a man means I can be weak. To be a man means I can fail at some things in life. So recalibrating the understanding of what it means to be a man. And really, you know, because one of my early influences was Eddie Murphy. And Eddie Murphy, you know, I was watching Raw when I shouldn't have been watching Raw. And Eddie was like, you become a man when you conquer as much as you can, right?

1:03:34 You know, and I want to be clear. I want to overcorrect that kind of thinking that we access our value, that we access our manhood based on our proximity to how much we get, how many women we have, how much we have in our pockets, how much we store up, and really learn how to see yourself as inherently enough, right? That, you know, the preacher in me is that you are prenatally affirmed, right? You know, just to be, so I want my son to know that he is enough, even with what he does not have, even with what he cannot produce, even when he is weak, that he is enough. My daughter, I want her to be clear that in this life, you do not escape without being broken, right? And I want my son to know that too, but in this life, that you will have horrible relationships, and you can rebound from those. You will have men in your life who will treat you just for your flesh, and you can survive that. So having honest conversations about that life has a way of breaking you, but your brokenness does not make you incomplete, right?

1:04:55 That when you find yourself broken, when you find yourself frustrated, when you find yourself feeling like you are not enough, that is the myth that the world is trying to tell you about yourself because all of us go through this life by being broken by something, whether it's relationships, whether it's family. You know, I hope I'm a good dad. That's the first thing. Like, I don't want to be the template that she decides to date against. Wow. Right?

1:05:22 So much more than what I want to tell her, I want to show her what it means to be a good human being, a full human being that knows how to be in loving relationships that are mutual, creative, supportive, and flourishing. I want to thank you all for answering mine. I think we've got a few that we're going to try to do quickly. Do we have people on microphones or how's it working? If there's a question, someone has a mic, go ahead with it. We'll just move quickly. We don't have time for many, but to do an opportunity. I have a question. Wait, wait. You'll start and then we'll give you the mic. Go ahead, sis. Hi. Thank you guys for coming out. This has been very illuminating. My name is Brittany. I have a question for any or all of you. Sort of related to your pet peeve answers, but not specific to any one thing you said, said but just curious about like how much of a chance do you give a woman to really like see her full self because you might see little things that could indicate something but actually it's really not that and obviously we've all had past experiences so people are not going to come into the situation perfect so how much are you giving a woman an opportunity to show you who she is and maybe like it's not insecurity she just really thinks that one woman shouldn't be talking to you like that so you know I'm just curious about that maybe just one answer and then so we get a chance as many as possible yeah I think I think when I say pet peeve I'm talking about repetitive things that are continuing after we have addressed them because I don't I don't want you to take what I'm I'm saying as far as, you know, like people being in my face or whatever the case is, if I'm doing my job over here to reassure you and to reassure my love for you and know that you are not in competition with nobody that's in my face, I shouldn't have to work overly hard to alter my whole thing and that always be a thing.

1:07:33 So I think that once we talk about it, we hash it out, we know we are. And I think, but it's, I think it's a continual thing. I don't think it's like, oh, you know, the moment that conversation came up without hearing detail of why you feel the way that you feel. I'm always open to, well, why do you feel that way? And why is this? And so I think that it's a repetitive thing for me. Brittany, I want to just chime in. I think it's important for a man to be able to express where that disappointment is. And now I'm watching how you respond. Right. So if I, in a productive, peaceful, and loving way, share that this is a problem for me, and it is repeated, or the response is kind of like, well, that's your problem, then okay, you're Leah. I get that. That's clear. And I think the fullest expression of humanity, whether male or female, always comes out in anger. Watch how people respond and how they act in anger.

1:08:30 because when the filter's off and the representative's gone, the anger will bring out the real person and now I've got to make a decision, okay, Lord, can I deal with this? If this person never changes from this behavior when they're angry, can I live with that? Yes, sir. And if I make a determination that I can't, I've got to be man enough to express that and to walk away from my own well-being. You know, there's some... I often think that some of the things that we label insecurities, some of the things that we label as problematic actually grow out of trauma, right? Like some of the stuff we do and we say we want to get over it, but we don't even know where it came from. We're dealing with symptoms and we haven't even hit the source of the sickness, right? So some of the things that I have historically defined as problematic, historically defined as an insecurity, as pettiness, has really been connected to pain and scars and wounds that have been afflicted on her by somebody else. And that she never had or we never had the opportunity to really diagnose what's going on there.

1:09:45 Why do you get this angry about this particular subject, right? And so part of the thing, I think, if it's a relationship worth keeping, you know, because think about it. Jacob, the Bible says that he eventually learned to love Leah, right? Right. So there's some stuff you learn to grow through together, right? So some of the things that I may name as a pet peeve may actually be something once I realize where it comes from and we're willing now to co-heal each other, right, to participate in each other's healing, then we have that, it can be that Jacob Leah, we've learned to grow through this together. But if you refuse to go to counseling over certain stuff, then you're telling me you're not really prioritizing your own emotional health. So, some of the things that I have labeled as insecurities were really a part of someone's undiagnosed sickness, right, that we really need to take seriously because we don't take mental health very seriously. And, you know, and some of it has to do with our unchecked mental health that we really need to help each other with because there are a lot of stuff, there's probably stuff I do, I don't even know why I do it.

1:10:57 Yeah, yeah. Thank you. We've got a few more. Hi. Earlier on, you had mentioned something about how getting cheated on had exposed the gap in the boyfriend you thought you were and the boyfriend you really were. And from the outside looking in as a woman, I feel like, especially amongst my women group, I've seen that. Like me and my women friends, we see that in men. And I'm wondering if maybe the other two would like to speak on it. looking back on it do you feel like there were times when there was a clear gap and the woman was trying to explain it to you and you didn't hear it um how often is that happening for men really or for you guys specifically uh yeah and that's why i could i could relate to him i mean even with even with my the situation that i went through later on as you said i had to go i had to go through that bitter moment first like nah that's just her da da da but then i finally able to get to moment where I was able to actually text her that I'm glad she was able to say yes to her, even if it meant no to me. Because I do realize later on that, like, there may have been some things where I was an obstacle. And because of that self-interrogation, it helped me to be able to see that, that I needed, that there were maybe times where I was being told, okay, I need you to be better at this. I need you to do this. I need you to do that. And that every time there is a disagreement isn't necessarily to belittle me, but it's to help correct to become a better me.

1:12:27 And those are things that I struggled with. And so I think in that moment, for me, that's something I had to get to as well. All right. Take our, this is our last one, Brandon. This is our last. Go ahead. Question, just about being social in the kingdom. I'm a New Yorker, and in New York, they're like a beast you can't walk down the street without being holiday but when you come to DC or the kingdom it's like no I like you right but let's just have this conversation do you guys prefer that to be hollered at or a lot of sisters in here want to know All right.

1:13:23 Let me, I'm going to let that be the last, but I want to tag onto it. Because you and I were having this discussion earlier about the DM. It goes down. And I think the terminology is shooting your shot. What's a big mistake a woman will make in shooting a shot towards you? I keep hearing benediction, benediction. Now on to him. So for me, you know, we always go with the biblical answer, a man that findeth a wife finds a good thing.

1:14:14 It is a man's job to pursue or whatever the case is. But I will say, in order for a man to find, one must be available. Presentable. presentable okay um but you know like like when it comes to i i do think that you can make conversation and dialogue without coming across as thirsty needy and a lot of times i you know i don't know about these men but i know a lot of my guys especially at my church we talk about all the time how there are women that already have a preconceived wedding all they need is a standing actor so all you need is a man to come in and say I do because you already know what colors you already figured it out you think about it every day and so forth and so on we can't even go on a date and I get to learn your last name before you call your girlfriend oh this may be it what's up how you doing what's your favorite color so so I don't think it's anything wrong but I do think the overly aggressiveness can automatically be a turnoff because again however you start it if you start off as leading it you're gonna have to always lead it then you're gonna be mad when you're trying to figure out where y'all gonna go out to eat you're gonna be mad when you got to plan the date you're gonna be mad when all it is but you've taken the lead the whole time. So you've taken away a part of his masculinity without you even knowing it. I think that conversation can be there, but allow him to pursue you. If he does not pursue you, then he must, he must not be interested. I think, I think that one, I don't, I don't mind being pursued. I'm not saying in this moment, I'm saying just in general as, as an existential, I think, existentially, I'm okay with being pursued because I actually do find value in people who know what they want and people who are willing to move toward what they want, right?

1:16:29 So, I don't have a problem with, you know, because I'm actually, I think that I don't think it's the man's job to find the woman. I think we find each other in some way. But our paths cross in some way. We find each other. And I want to say I'm also okay with whenever I get married, I'm okay with having alternating leadership, right? I actually don't want to lead the whole time, right? Actually, I want you to pastor me some days, right? I need you to pray for me when I don't know what I need to be prayed for. I need you to lay hands on me when I don't know what I, you know, I need to be pastored by my wife as well. So that alternating leadership is important for me. That's why I've said it a few times tonight, mutuality is so significant, right? This idea of, like, if equality is going to be real, it has to be real. And, you know, I hope my wife has gifts that bring me alive, gifts that make me better.

1:17:31 So alternating leadership is important. And if she finds me, I'm okay with that as well. But the one way not to pursue me is to tell me God said. I was waiting. That was it. I was waiting. And if that didn't come out, it was going to be my closing comment. Yeah. Willie, talk, talk, talk, talk, talk. No, no. Ain't the way. That's the wrong way. That ain't. That's the one that I was going to say too. Because it's as if I didn't have a conversation with God. Right, right. As if God couldn't tell me that you were supposed to be the one. So I answered the second one with that. first one I think as well, I think I'm in agreement with Willie as well, is that I don't mind that because I do think that it's admirable that somebody can say okay, I like you, here's why.

1:18:28 And I don't mind us being able to grow out of that. I think there's possibilities from that. Of a woman being able to say this is what I want. And sometimes that wakes something up in me. They're like, oh wow. Okay. I never noticed that. You know, even if I – this is another reason why I think women who want to pursue a brother, women who want to pursue men for whatever reason, I think that another reason I think is okay because even though I may know what I want, I'm not always aware of what I need. And sometimes I don't know what I need until I encounter it. Yeah. Ladies and gentlemen, would you help me thank A.D., Trey, and Willie for an awesome conversation on tonight. Come on, let me bless God for them tonight. Here's what we're about to do. So we can leave on time.

1:19:23 If you sit down for a minute, I'm going to close this with a prayer and ask a blessing on them as they travel. Afterwards, if you're here tonight and you want to know more about this amazing love God has for you in Jesus Christ, we invite you to come down to the altar. We've got some deacons and ministers who would be there joy to share with you how God proved God's love for you in an undeniable way. And if you're here and you desire to become part of something bigger than yourself, like Alfred Street. Come on down. It'll be our joy. We've always got space and room for you. Won't you bow with me? We're going to pray. And then we're going to leave this place in the grace and peace of God. Lord, thank you for your presence. And thank you, Lord, for allowing us to hear your voice.

1:20:01 My prayer is that our conversation tonight would have presented a mirror in front of each and every one of us to think about who we are and who you've called us to be with. We thank you, O Lord, for the maturity and the growth of these three men who have courageous and with transparency and vulnerability shared from their own heart and journey. God, pour back into them. Grant them safe travel back home. May they find things well. Lord, we ask that in the right season, in the right place, you would attach each and every one of us to that helpmate, that we might be what you've created us to be. Thank you, Lord, for Kaya, and I pray your hand upon it as I release it back to you for January, February, and March.

1:20:52 God, show yourself strong. Be with us until we meet together again. In Jesus' name we pray. Amen. Go in the grace of God, and may the grace of God go with you.