Finding Your Voice

0:02 Hello, my love. Hello, hello, hello. So fun to be here. We've already had great sex this morning. Yes, we have. Yes, we have. This is true. I am honored that we are sharing that. Well, you share it so freely with so many of your friends. Privately on FaceTimes with my friends. Well, I'm on conversational FaceTime. Obviously not. Oh, my goodness. No, no, no, no, no, no. Let's clarify. No, no, no, no. Like this morning, after we had sex, I was FaceTiming. I hear you telling a friend. Yeah, and I was like, well, I mean, you know, we're keeping each other accountable. I just wanted to start that way because I feel like so often we start out and be like, the week has been so boozy. I haven't seen you. It's just great to have a conversation together. Yeah, that's true.

0:53 So I feel like it's honest to be like, man, you're doing good today. We are. Start of the morning out with sex. Yeah, I feel so connected. I need that. I know. It really is pretty crazy. how much sex connects you. I agree. Very beautiful. It was also fun. We had such a good family dinner last night. We really did. Yeah. Talking about fun stuff and our son getting married. Yeah. It was fun. It was the most wedding details he has told me. Shared. Yeah. Yeah. I was savoring every minute. It actually makes me emotional. It's been a while since all three of our kids have been around a table together because Zion's been working so much lately. and just those moments you just want to you know when something good is happening like i don't want to blink i don't want to move because i don't want it to end like that's how it felt it was so so true it was so so true so we're going to this episode is going to be around 30 minutes or so we're going to try maybe do you want to say that are we not really saying that we're just doing it we can get that part out but people can tell how long an episode is or we can leave it They have a little timer that says how long it's going to be.

2:02 Good point, yeah. You know. I'm excited to explore different lengths of time. I am too. You know what's so cool? I got a DM from somebody this week. And she said, she goes, I'm single. I live by myself. Every Monday when I cook dinner, I make dinner listening to you guys. And it's so, she goes, I just feel like I'm having dinner with friends. What's her name? I can't remember. Oh. I don't know my name. Hey, I know you're making dinner right now. we love you and thank you for listening and it means the world. Yeah, I just thought that was really fulfilling to me. Very fulfilling. Are you kidding me? That is so meaningful to me. To feel like there's a I can see it and feel it. Right, a conversation with friendships. That is the goal. That is the goal. Especially people who are find themselves alone. I listen to podcasts and I'm driving by myself. I'm not a huge music person. I'm definitely more of a podcaster. It is. You feel not alone in those moments. I love it. I'm excited to talk today in these next few moments about something that I have always admired about you. Well, already this is one of my favorite episodes. Right? Started with sex. Now we're getting into admiration. I feel like you have always been fully who you are and very confident in who you are. Thank you. And I think that is a gift. I think it's probably something that comes a little bit naturally to you. I know for me, that has been much more of a struggle and a fight to find my voice, to find my identity, to like who I am, to be confident in that. And you probably don't know the difference of what it's like to not be your authentic self and be your authentic self. Is that true? So I don't think you're going to be able to relate to the feeling of not being your authentic self. I can relate to those feelings and i'm excited to get into the conversation of how to truly find yourself that sounded kind of cheesy like how is it so poetic how do i find me when you say like to find your authentic self that sounds great when you just say find yourself that comes across a

4:09 little cheeky yeah it's not nearly poetic it's not it's not least poetic and cool um is is my assumption true in my admiration for you true do you feel like you've always known yourself I definitely had a huge head start. And I, you know, when I feel like you compliment me or my dearest, nearest friends compliment me, which I'm really grateful for, like anybody else, I know I know deeply what it is to feel insecure or out of your element or that sort of thing. But, you know, I you know, my mom and dad were very encouraging, particularly what my mom still is. My dad was really committed to encouraging me along the lines of people like you and want to hear what you have to say. And I believe that. I think actually this morning I woke up thinking about our kids. And man, have I done that?

5:03 Didn't know we were going to be talking about this today in our podcast. But am I doing that? I think I grew up with a lot of confidence. And I've always, I just feel like I can take little to no credit for, yeah, I just, I really enjoy being me and I like what I do. And I feel oftentimes probably the sensation, I'm just glad I'm nobody else. And I don't know why that is. And I'm just really, really grateful for it. And like anybody else, I oftentimes wish I was Denzel Washington, but, you know, I'm not. As people do. Oh, of course, as people do.

5:44 But yeah, I'm really happy to be me. And I think it means a lot hearing that from you because you've lived nearly every day with me for the last 25 years. Thank you for giving your parents a lot of credit for that. Tons. Your sister is very much the same way. Yeah. I think she's very much her authentic self, very confident in who she is, knows her voice. To me, it seems like she really always has known her voice. I agree.

6:08 Yeah, as you're saying that, What made you wonder and think, am I doing that enough for my kids? I think my dad was just so intentional about that part of instilling confidence in Wendy and I, my older sister. I just was wondering. I think last night our middle son, Elliot, came over and kissed me on the cheek and hugged me. I was like, am I giving this guy enough affection that he initiated? He's such a take. I was like, man, I better lean in. And then you just think of our other son who's gotten engaged and you're like, oh, my word. We're counting down the hours now, really, of him being in our home, which is a whole wild emotion. So, yeah, I just want to make sure that I'm instilling that in them. We're Smiths and our motto is we're kind and encouraging and we look for lonely people. But from that comes from a basis of confidence and knowing who we are.

7:03 So, again, I'm so grateful for my mom and dad. But also I think, you know, I got to marry you and I think you don't struggle at all with fear of missing out. You don't wish you I can't remember one afternoon or evening where the pain that you were in was in any way correlated or connected to the idea of I just wish I was somebody else. I just think I don't know how much credit we can take for that. I am grateful. I appreciate people's admiration in that regard. But I also have a huge heart and a lot of empathy for people who are like, man, I struggle having confidence and contentment in who I am. Yeah, that's interesting. I grew up with incredible parents, but I don't think they were as intentional with instilling confidence in me and my sister that your parents were with you and your sister. but when you said our Smith family motto which was for years hey we're Smiths we're kind and encouraging we look for lonely people that is who our kids are and they do do that and this isn't a parenting episode but it is interesting to me you know somebody once said in a leadership a leadership quote of hey you get what you go for and really interesting with our kids too like I think a lot of it is in terms of leadership yeah in terms of leadership yeah you get you know what you emphasize, what you make a big deal of times you get that result.

8:25 The thing is you can't emphasize and make a big deal about everything. I just, there is a moment where I just have to trust that, Hey, God's plan for our kids was that we would emphasize we're Smiths. We're kind, we're encouraging. We look, we look for lonely people. That was God's plan for our kids, so to speak, you know, I mean, my parents did emphasize that other things that I'm really grateful for. And no parents can give every kid every gift. Don't you think? Yeah. Like it's just, you only do. I feel better already. Thank you. He only have 18 years and he got it dressed. Yeah. If I'm really honest, I'm like, we're going to get to some practical points and some great conversations. In fact, let me read this quote, which is fascinating. The journal of personality and social psychology found that individuals who feel they can express their true selves, they report higher levels of social connection and well being. interesting it's like of course it's kind of one of those things that wow it took a study to prove that but interesting that there is a study that proves that that when we are authentic selves we are more socially connected we have a deeper sense of well-being um i could really say i think for me a huge part of finding myself finding my voice was you which i don't know if I'm allowed to admit that as a woman in 2024.

9:49 I don't think it was you as a man necessarily, but you as a partner in life and just your confidence giving me so much confidence and, and just speaking so much life into me. I appreciate that. No, that would be my genuine. I mean, it wasn't hard. Assessment. I said I didn't have to lie. That would have been a bummer. No, you can do it. I don't know. Can she? You know, I think by now, anyone who knows us or, or maybe follow some of the stuff we do and say realizes, you know, your brilliance and capacity and capability and your continued pursuit of information and education and exploration and exposure, which is pretty incredible as you are doing your master's degree, which is amazing. And you have every intention of going on to your PhD. And I look forward to both of us being PhDs together. Oh, yeah. What are you going to get your PhD?

10:41 What are you going to get your doctorate in? Oh, whatever you're getting yours in. Oh, we'll get it together. I know. I think I'm like two-thirds of the way from my master's. I really, I just, I think I want to pursue my doctorate in church history just so I can have an excuse to go to Europe and tour churches. Deal. That's weird. That's exactly what I wanted to get my PhD in. Truly, actually, church history has been one of the most transformative things that I've studied. So there is that too. But really interesting when this subject came up and obviously surprised to you as I was thinking about it. how our knee jerk reaction was that our experience has been finding our voice and finding our authentic selves in the context of close relationships. You from your parents, me, a lot of it from you. Um, what are your thoughts on that? Oh man, it just, it's, it's so incredible, the human condition and capacity to mirror your surroundings, good or bad. And that when you surround yourself around secure and confident people, it rubs off. And I am a big, big, big believer in that. And man, in one ways, I think I'd love to say as I've gotten older, I'm more impervious to insecure people or worriers or anxious, you know, energy, but, but I actually feel like I'm more sensitive to it and I'm, uh, a little bit more, um, impacted by it. And so, yeah, as we, it's interesting because someone warned me as you get older, your, your no becomes far more important than your yes. And I think being able to have the courage to say, Hey, no, there's, there's a boundary here. Like I'm, I'm not going to just absorb and accept kind of insecure, gossipy, self-serving kind of energy and social interactions.

12:45 We're going to really commit to building people up and not taking ourselves too seriously and being someone who believes that human beings are the prize and that we want to really encourage them. So I think we have benefited greatly as we have been aging or being, being careful and selective about, about the individuals in our, in our space. Remember when we first got married and, you know, like a marriage is a merging and blending of a lot of things like finances, you know, responsibilities, all things, but it's also a merging of friends. Yeah. And you brought a couple friend to the table. So we're, who we hung out with a few times and he just constantly cut you down, just constantly made little digs at you. And I, I don't, I don't want to go into the reason why to me, I would have guessed it was his own insecurity. and I just I don't enjoy hanging out with people when he's constantly cutting you down can we not be friends with these people and that was an interesting choice that we made early on in our marriage yeah and I think you know there's tells I don't know if we're going to jump into this tributary but when it comes to building the kind of environment that will help you find yourself and find your true self and be the most confident version of you.

14:10 I think the environment you put yourself is very much at play and has a huge role and part in either adding to that or detracting from that. And I think we made decisions that, first of all, we live by a concept that only a small person makes others feel small. But it takes a big person to make others feel big. So it's funny. I'd rather compliment people than compete with people. And there are pretty obvious social tells when it comes to people who are competing or complimenting, comparing or encouraging. And we've just decided to, first of all, be the kind of people we want to be around. I think that's an interesting thing we could digress into. And that is that, like, oftentimes everybody wants you want to be around encouraging people. But oftentimes you don't want to start by being an encouraging person. And I think the littlest of things end up really, really shaping.

15:07 If you're like me and you, you wake up one day and you're 45 and you're like, oh, I guess this actually is our life. Yeah. So much. And this is who I am. This is who I am. This is where we are. This is who we are. And wow, you got to kind of own that. There's still growth and there's still change, but you're never going to be an NBA player. And I'm never going to be a tennis player. Yeah. As much as we dreamed about it. I know one of the things I struggled with in trying to find my true self was I remember, because I was a human development major in my undergrad, so taking so many personality tests. And I hated taking personality tests. And the reason why was in pretty much every one, it came up that I'm an introvert. Shocker. Whoa. but I had this perception that in our society introverts are less valuable than extroverts and so because I felt like I have a character quality a characteristic part of my personality and makeup is something that isn't valued by society I rejected it and didn't want it and didn't embrace it and wanted to play pretend like I was something else.

16:23 And we could go all day long about introverts and extroverts and read a book that's like the power of introverts. It was called quiet is really life changing for me actually. Yeah. I remember you reading that book. In that specific area. Yep. But we all have care personnel. Our authentic selves are filled with things that our society deems as valuable and things that our society deems as less valuable. How do we embrace all of who we are in the areas that our society doesn't seem to make a big deal of?

17:00 Yeah, it's really, really good. I mean, the most candid and honest answer I can give really gets back to something I believe fundamentally about the divine. and about God, and that is that God knows me better than I know myself. He is fully aware of and connected to my strengths and my weaknesses, and one of the scriptures that is just revolutionary to me as it pertains to knowing who I am and being who I am is that this idea of that, you know, when I am weak, then I am strong. There's this portion of the Testament where this guy that God uses named Paul, who writes probably more than half of the New Testament, he says, you know, I kept asking God to take away these weaknesses, whatever that is, take away these shortcomings, take away these inadequacies. The thorn in the flesh.

18:01 The thorn in the flesh, right? Which is, I like that it's poetic. Yeah, it is poetic. And he said, basically, the answer he got, God was like, nah. And that the response from God was, you know, when you're weak, then you're strong. And my power rests on you. So I think what's hard to disconnect Judah and Chelsea from is that we believe in this divine being, this father, who is acquainted with our weaknesses. In fact, more than acquainted, he has decided to cover our weakness. and by that not meaning he doesn't challenge us and help us and convict us and but but where we are weak if we are willing to say damn weak he's like i can turn it into a strength because your weakness will become don't take a big breath on me yet because you know i'm gonna just don't do that i know what you're doing okay i will pause on the big breath thank you dear god but I know let me just say it let me say it very quickly and that is that I think as it pertains to strengthens strengths and weaknesses it's hard for me to articulate how I relate to my weakness without articulating what I believe about this great grand god who who accepts me fully even with my weakness and so I see a weakness as a portal to continue to need him, depend on him, rely on him inversely, what that, or conversely, or in an inverted way.

19:45 Now I get to fully embrace my strengths while admitting fully my weakness. And before I know it, I call it integration. Now I'm like, I'm not in denial. I'm not trying to keep my weaknesses secret and private. And so I think there's an integration there that, that leads to, do some confident living yeah i think what i'm taking a big breath about is no i don't think you understood the question is that i don't see being an introvert as a weakness not at all um oh was i communicating that no no no no but i but we live in a society that tends to does that make sense and i'm not talking man i totally missed the question then but i actually really love what the answer what the answer was was hey i did not in any way intend to say that No, no, no, no. Introverts have shaped the world as we know it. So have extroverts. But there are just certain character qualities that our society views as more valuable that aren't necessarily strengths or weaknesses.

20:46 Yeah. But our society just puts on a different stratosphere. Oh, this is more important. And this has this type of pay grade to it. And that's, that's, I don't think is a, um, spiritual issue so much as it is, as it is a societal one, but because we are spiritual beings, I love that you gave a spiritual answer. Um, the other day I was talking to, to one of our kids and they're in the, um, the origin of the species, you know, science class right now in school. And I was like, I was going to say, she says grace. I was talking to grace. And she's telling me that literally in their class, they had to write down, like, do you believe yes or no that like we came from that we evolved from apes or whatever and you know grace is like no and it said why you had to put why you do or don't believe in that grace is like no for religious purposes you know that's funny right i'm gonna do that more right why do you not believe that for religious purposes like the time you tried like the time you tried to and turn to a plate an establishment where no hats were allowed they tried to take you to take your hat off and you said you were wearing it for religious purposes.

21:52 Ah, religious purposes. And then I walked out and he's like, hey, pastor, I know why you're wearing the beanie. And I was like, oh, didn't know you went to our church. My bad. Sorry about that. That was a funny story. Yeah. It's a steakhouse. Yeah. Yeah, that's great. I mean, the steakhouse needed to relax. I mean, my word, let a guy wear a beanie, huh? Right. My hair was a mess. We were there. We could have had our rules anyway for religious purposes. Sorry. But then Grace is like, hey, why do you believe that, you know, we were created by God? And I said, you know, there's a lot of the details of creation that I don't understand necessarily. I said, but I do know how much strength and confidence it gives me to believe that I was formed and shaped by God. Yeah. Even fallen world, so many things. Fearfully and wonderfully made. That if God wanted me to be an extrovert, I would be an extrovert. That's right. If God wanted me to be, like, I always wanted to get to be 5'9". Like, I don't know, that was just my target goal.

22:44 I made it like 5'7 and three quarters. But if God wanted me to be 5'9, I would have been 5'9. And just the ease, the confidence that that can bring and that letting go of that and really trusting that I am made and shaped and created by a loving Heavenly Father who has a plan for my life. Wow. It really does. It really does. Oh, man, that's huge. Don't you think, too, a lot of the reasons we are afraid to be our authentic self has to do with fear. Oh my word. Absolutely. And if I'm reject, if you never know the real me, but you reject me, I can live with that. But if you know the real me and you choose not to love me, you choose not to see me, you choose not to appreciate me or value me, then that is just so much more devastating.

23:41 Quite literally, you have rejected me. And I think billions of people never end up showing their true self for fear of a rejection that is so profound. And I completely understand that. And don't fault anyone for being like, I don't think I'm ever going to bring my full self to stuff. because what if I would be fully rejected? Because I can go home at night and tell myself, well, they don't really know me. If they really knew me, they wouldn't reject me. It's like the same fear of, oh, if I don't really try hard on this test and I fail it, then I just didn't try hard. Oh, that's what I do when I start playing bad golf. I act like I don't care because I care so much. And if I care too much, then I fail and it's going to hurt. So then it's like, I don't care and I didn't try. So that's why.

24:33 Yeah. Yeah, that's real. That is very real. Oh, golf. Oh, golf. um so what that fear is real that fear of rejection that fear of people see the real me if i if i what if i what if i get into this and i don't like my authentic self then how do i live with myself so i'm just not even gonna try or start or or dig into this yeah and I think you know in good faith obviously has the word faith in it so it's pretty obvious that you know and both you and I have um minister license we are licensed ministers we can do all of the sacred events and moments in people's lives and dedicate babies and weddings and funerals and such. And we've both done some Bible schooling and all that. But, but I, I certainly both you and I don't want this podcast just to be simply defined by Christianity. Um, this is a exploration of, of the human journey and the human existence. But I, I, I do have days where I wonder, um, you can label me whatever you want, crutch, all that, but it's like, yeah, I just don't know how people move through this life without a sense of this gregarious divine being. I will give flowers to people who don't believe there's a God. That takes an exorbitant amount of faith in my thoughts, extraordinary amount of faith, more faith than I think it takes to believe in an architect and a designer and a creator. But I believe that that architect and designer and creator designs with a profound and deep purpose. I think we have all been flawed by free will. And yet in his sovereignty, he allows free will. So I think what I'm saying is in short, because you took a deep breath again,

26:41 which means I need to close up my thoughts. I wake up with this real personal intimate sense that God put me in this world at this time with my name, with my makeup for a reason, for a plan. And he's proud of me and he loves me even in my shortcomings. Like anybody else, we all have a stage of some kind and our stages are all different. In some cases, like me and you, we actually have an actual steps we go up to and we actually stand on a stage every now and again, and we literally have a stage. But when I go to my stage, the stage God has asked me to step up to, I can't tell you how many times I've lost count as I'm walking up that stage going, I definitely don't have the credentials, the makeup, or the consistency that warrants, earns, or deserves me to step on the stage.

27:36 but I go up those stairs knowing that if I'm weak, he's strong and he'll make up the difference and make up the Delta. And, and if I'm honest, that's how I step on the stage of life every day, not to be too, um, ridiculously dramatic, but it really is. I do a lot of self-talk every day and it has a lot to do with, I am who I am by God's creation and God's design and God's makeup. And I, I trust him. I have my discrepancies with God on some of the ways he made me and why he did that. But nonetheless, here I am and I'm trusting him to help me. Yeah. And I think that's the only genuine answer that I could give. At least for us. As far as like, how do you find and embrace your authentic self? You have to believe that somebody values you and loves you for exactly who you are. and whether our society finds those things as great or not great, that your creator, God, the divine, actually does love you and embrace you for who you are.

28:41 And if it doesn't start there, I actually don't know where else it can start. And from, are you going to say something? Yeah, no. You're taking a deep breath. No, no, no deep breath here. I'm just, you know, I'm feeling the flow and I'm excited. I just, I don't know. I just want to say something to some people out there that I think in moments like this and topics like this, episodes like this, podcasts like this, messages like this, start to go, yeah, but what if they don't like me? Yeah, but what if they don't accept me? What if they don't protect me? What if they don't care for me? What if no one cares for me and protects me? And so what we do is we augment how we bring ourselves to the room, the proverbial room. And one of the things I have found deep comfort in is that it only took 33 years.

29:52 But in 33 years of pure and utter, total, complete perfection, by all accounts, that I truly believe, Jesus never committed sin. In other words, he never committed a selfish, self-serving, self-centered, missing the mark action. Tempted? Yes, but never did. And yet, 33 years into his manifestation on this planet in the Middle East, the masses started chanting that he would be executed in the most worst and horrific way. crucify him, crucify him, crucify him. And I got to say it because it's worth saying, any way you slice it, there is going to be people who curse you and want you to fail.

30:53 And in some cases, they want to see you hurt and you can be perfect. And that can still be served In fact, I would say, if you are perfect, which there is only one, but even if that was possible, you might be hated more because you are perfect. So I say that to say, like, as we sit here recording this podcast, if we did this 10 years ago, this would be a completely different episode for me. It just would, because I would say that if you do some things right, a lot of people will like you. 10 years later, 35 to 45, we have had more people exit our life than I would have ever imagined in my lifetime. And I don't mean a mass exodus as much as I mean people who are just like, no, thanks.

31:50 I don't understand the direction you're taking, the course you're taking, the vernacular you're using, the approach, the decisions, the vision. I don't get it. I'm out. And in some cases, some people have felt really passionate about the direction we've taken. And yet, in a way, it's galvanized you and me. And I think we've become more passionate about being who we believe God's asked us to be.